Post: #1

I've been looking into dual-citizenship recently, and came across the concept of jus sanguinis, which means the descendants of a native-born citizen of a certain country are usually eligible to become naturalized based on lineage. The concept is relevant to me for Italian citizenship, but I was wondering if any of you guys have experience going through the process of obtaining the 20 or so documents needed to begin the process. What other countries use this? I know there are companies that will obtain these documents for you, but has anyone used them?

My great-grandfather was born to two Italians in this country, but his father was born in Palermo and came to the US in 1893 at the age of six. The caveat with jus sanguinis that concerned me was that, according to the Italian government, if an Italian (my great-great-grandfather) became naturalized in another country, he lost his ability to confer jus sanguinis to his children. Since my great-great-grandfather was six when he came over, I was relying on a hunch that naturalization laws in the US during the early 1900's were still strict against some European countries, and I needed this man to remain an Italian allllll the way until 1916 when my great-grandfather was born.

Looking at US immigration laws between 1900-1930, I found that there are 3 abbreviations used on the census to denote immigrants- Al for alien, Pa for someone who has started the naturalization process but is still considered an alien, and Na for naturalized. If great-great-granddad was naturalized before 1916, I was fucked. On ancestry.com, I found him in the US census for 1920, 4 years after my great-grandfather was born. He was listed as Pa, meaning he was still an alien 4 years prior. Success! Jus sanguinis transferred to my great-grandfather, then my grandmother, my mother, and finally, me.

I felt like I was in a fucking detective movie, pacing around my bedroom at 4 in the morning muttering to myself. Anyway, this process can take up to a year, and involves going as far back as Italian birth certificates from the 1800's. Still exciting, though.

Post: #2

Ah shit. My grandmother was born 6 months before an arbitrary cut-off date in 1948 where women can pass down citizenship. Well then.

EDIT: Shows how convoluted the laws are, the above would be true if I was talking about my grandmother's mother passing heritage, but since we are looking at her father, the 1948 law doesn't apply.

Post: #3

I've done it - well worth it in case you don't have another EU citizenship. The documentation isn't difficult but can be time consuming to search through many records. You may have mistakes to correct, which can be difficult (but see below).

(05-16-2014 11:09 AM)Sweet Pea Wrote:  Ah shit. My grandmother was born 6 months before an arbitrary cut-off date in 1948 where women can pass down citizenship. Well then.

EDIT: Shows how convoluted the laws are, the above would be true if I was talking about my grandmother's mother passing heritage, but since we are looking at her father, the 1948 law doesn't apply.

You can challenge the 1948 rule in court. PM me if you're interested and I'll give you the details of a good lawyer who deals with that kind of case. He's processed hundreds of them successfully. Legal and court fees come to about 5000 Euros, but you can split them between yourself and anyone else who is a descendent of your Italian ancestors. Also, the courts are less picky about mistakes than the consular staff.

The whole thing should take about two years from the time you start collecting documents.

Post: #4

Also, if you're applying through the consulate, make an appointment now, because they're booked out for a year or more in many places.

Post: #5

Good luck.

Post: #6

Ireland!

Thing is it takes forever though. It's definitely worth it if you ever want to work or own property in the EU.

Post: #7

Thanks guys, as far as I can tell, I should be set. My grandmother was born in 1946, but according to my understanding she would have been passed down the ability to naturalized from her father, not her mother. And he received the ability from his Italian father. It's kind of crazy that there is no limit on the number of generations one can go back. I can only prove that I'm 1/16 Italian but that's good enough.

Post: #8

(05-16-2014 05:34 PM)Sweet Pea Wrote:  It's kind of crazy that there is no limit on the number of generations one can go back. I can only prove that I'm 1/16 Italian but that's good enough.

There is kind of a limit - you have to prove that your ancestor was in Italy in 1861 or later - the date Italy was unified. You'll have marriage/birth records from Palermo to prove that.

Post: #9

Looks good, let us know more.