Post: #1

What to make of this AP story?

Women fought for years to get in the armed forces only to say they don't actually want to fight. This was a survey of nearly all the service's 170,000 women:

"Less than 8 percent of Army women who responded to the survey said they wanted a combat job. Of those, an overwhelming number said they'd like to be a Night Stalker — a member of the elite special operations helicopter crews who perhaps are best known for flying the Navy SEALS into Osama bin Laden's compound in 2011."

"Last year top Pentagon officials signed an order saying women must have the same opportunities as men in combat jobs and the services have been devising updated physical standards, training, education and other programs for thousands of jobs they must open Jan. 1, 2016. The services must open as many jobs to women as possible; if they decide to keep some closed, they must explain why."

Is anyone else getting cognitive dissonance here: give us the equal opportunity we don't actually want! Even if you're not in the service, this mindset has been known to pop up in the workplace and is indicative, I think, of how women behave in professional situations, making demands for responsibilities they don't really want to take on.

Post: #2

Yeah, the new policy is dumb, if for only the reason that it defeats economies of scale.

When you have to reconfigure barracks and rewrite logistical requirements for the sake of the very very few women that would want to be in an infantry unit, it's a costly waste of money better used for other things.

There are many other reasons not to do it, of course.

Post: #3

(02-26-2014 08:15 AM)Days of Broken Arrows Wrote:  Women fought for years to get in the armed forces only to say they don't actually want to fight.

Damn right they don't want to fight. They want to get overpowered by dominant Muslim men and dragged into their harems where they are given transparent clothes and forced to do belly dancing.

Since this doesn't actually happen they just get impregnated by the sweaty staff sergeant and claim benefits. Or become a professional victim.

Post: #4

Some articles from women who were in combat zones.

http://hotair.com/archives/2013/01/27/so...e-veteran/

Quote:I say again, I would have loved to be in the infantry. I think I could have done it physically, I could’ve met almost all the male standards (jumping aside), and I think I’m mentally tough enough to handle whatever came. But I would never do that to the men. I would never sacrifice the mission for my own desires. And I wouldn’t be able to live with myself if someone died because of me.

http://www.mca-marines.org/gazette/artic...ated-equal

Quote:I was a motivated, resilient second lieutenant when I deployed to Iraq for 10 months, traveling across the Marine area of operations (AO) and participating in numerous combat operations. Yet, due to the excessive amount of time I spent in full combat load, I was diagnosed with a severe case of restless leg syndrome. My spine had compressed on nerves in my lower back causing neuropathy which compounded the symptoms of restless leg syndrome. While this injury has certainly not been enjoyable, Iraq was a pleasant experience compared to the experiences I endured during my deployment to Afghanistan. At the beginning of my tour in Helmand Province, I was physically capable of conducting combat operations for weeks at a time, remaining in my gear for days if necessary and averaging 16-hour days of engineering operations in the heart of Sangin, one of the most kinetic and challenging AOs in the country. There were numerous occasions where I was sent to a grid coordinate and told to build a PB from the ground up, serving not only as the mission commander but also the base commander until the occupants (infantry units) arrived 5 days later. In most of these situations, I had a sergeant as my assistant commander, and the remainder of my platoon consisted of young, motivated NCOs. I was the senior Marine making the final decisions on construction concerns, along with 24-hour base defense and leading 30 Marines at any given time. The physical strain of enduring combat operations and the stress of being responsible for the lives and well-being of such a young group in an extremely kinetic environment were compounded by lack of sleep, which ultimately took a physical toll on my body that I couldn’t have foreseen.

By the fifth month into the deployment, I had muscle atrophy in my thighs that was causing me to constantly trip and my legs to buckle with the slightest grade change. My agility during firefights and mobility on and off vehicles and perimeter walls was seriously hindering my response time and overall capability. It was evident that stress and muscular deterioration was affecting everyone regardless of gender; however, the rate of my deterioration was noticeably faster than that of male Marines and further compounded by gender-specific medical conditions. At the end of the 7-month deployment, and the construction of 18 PBs later, I had lost 17 pounds and was diagnosed with polycystic ovarian syndrome (which personally resulted in infertility, but is not a genetic trend in my family), which was brought on by the chemical and physical changes endured during deployment. Regardless of my deteriorating physical stature, I was extremely successful during both of my combat tours, serving beside my infantry brethren and gaining the respect of every unit I supported. Regardless, I can say with 100 percent assurance that despite my accomplishments, there is no way I could endure the physical demands of the infantrymen whom I worked beside as their combat load and constant deployment cycle would leave me facing medical separation long before the option of retirement. I understand that everyone is affected differently; however, I am confident that should the Marine Corps attempt to fully integrate women into the infantry, we as an institution are going to experience a colossal increase in crippling and career-ending medical conditions for females.

Post: #5

(02-26-2014 12:25 PM)vinman Wrote:  

Quote:I was a motivated, resilient second lieutenant . . . . There were numerous occasions where I was sent to a grid coordinate and told to build a PB from the ground up, serving not only as the mission commander but also the base commander until the occupants (infantry units) arrived 5 days later. In most of these situations, I had a sergeant as my assistant commander, and the remainder of my platoon consisted of young, motivated NCOs. I was the senior Marine making the final decisions on construction concerns, along with 24-hour base defense and leading 30 Marines at any given time. The physical strain of enduring combat operations and the stress of being responsible for the lives and well-being of such a young group in an extremely kinetic environment were compounded by lack of sleep, which ultimately took a physical toll on my body that I couldn’t have foreseen.

At the end of the 7-month deployment, and the construction of 18 PBs later, I had lost 17 pounds and was diagnosed with polycystic ovarian syndrome (which personally resulted in infertility, but is not a genetic trend in my family), which was brought on by the chemical and physical changes endured during deployment. Regardless of my deteriorating physical stature, I was extremely successful during both of my combat tours, serving beside my infantry brethren and gaining the respect of every unit I supported. Regardless, I can say with 100 percent assurance that despite my accomplishments, there is no way I could endure the physical demands of the infantrymen whom I worked beside as their combat load and constant deployment cycle would leave me facing medical separation long before the option of retirement.

A shame, she has good genes. Another casualty of the wars, makes me feel sad.

Post: #6

It's just another form of apex fallacy, this time with uglier chicks.

Of course they don't want to do the dirty, icky, hard stuff.

They want to go straight from boot camp to being a senior officer. So, they can play dress up in uniforms and have cool medals and stuff.

Post: #7

Even some of the roughest women I have seen on this earth have been squeamish when hearing some of the talk that goes on in an infantry platoon. I would never want a woman anywhere near some of my old units, purely for her own well-being. Nobody wins in this situation.

Post: #8

In history, most men didn't really want to see combat anyway, but they got marched to the front line nevertheless.

We should do the same with the women. Just make sure they're in women-only units so they don't get the men killed.

Post: #9

(02-26-2014 09:05 PM)StrikeBack Wrote:  In history, most men didn't really want to see combat anyway, but they got marched to the front line nevertheless.

We should do the same with the women. Just make sure they're in women-only units so they don't get the men killed.

Agreed.

Have women sign up for the military draft. If there are not enough women willing to volunteer for these all female front line units, then draft women. Feminists in the 1960's said women should have 50% of the wealth and power in the USA, and today they have more than 50%. So they should at least have 50% of the front line soldiers.

Lets see how "tough" these women are when they actually have to put up or shut up.

Post: #10

The reality is.... No woman can do a combat job.

I was in the infantry for many years. As a 6ft 2, 98kg man. I found it fucking daunting carrying 18kg of gear on my belt plus another 40kg in my pack. for days / weeks on end with 4 hours sleep a night and shitty ration food.

There are many men that can't do the basics needed to be in a combat role. I challenge you to show me a woman that can do it.

I remember when I joined the army, the basic fitness tests were reeaally pathetic. 40 pushups, 100 crunches and a 2.5km run in less than 12 minutes.
But as soon as the government started talking about letting women join combat roles, it aallll changed. People actually had to train for the basic fitness test. This is to weed out all the battle barbies that want to be the first woman in combat.

Post: #11

Sometimes, one of the surest ways of getting a woman to stop complaining about something they feel they're being denied is to GIVE IT TO THEM. Once it becomes real, and not a concept or idea, they shut the fuck up and say "nevermind." I just finished reading a book called "Inside Delta Force" by Eric L. Haney. He's a founding member of the nation's first counterterrorist unit, and the tv show "The Unit" is based on his book. The book is about what he had to go through to qualify - he couldn't discuss specific missions beyond that, because everything they do is covert. They aren't even considered regular military anymore, as all of their records are removed from the system. I can't imagine ANY woman making it much past the initial round of physical testing they had to endure to qualify for the elite units. The testing is also about seeing who can hold it together mentally as well as physically, because when you break down physically, it's your ability to think clearly that will keep you alive. Only elite soldiers were even selected as the initial candidates, and you had a lot of them just throw up their hands at the beginning of qualifying and say "FUCK THIS" and withdraw and return to their units. A lot of this is just removing certain restrictions on principle...just for show. They don't really want this.