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Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" Twitter Feminists
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Emancipator Offline
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Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" Twitter Feminists
There is an on going court case in Toronto (surprise, surprise!) for a man that after "creeping" and "offending" several twitter feminist was arrested and charged with three counts of criminal harassment.

What a world we live in

Quote:http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2014/0...sment.html

Where is the line between criminal harassment and Twitter trolling? An unusual and potentially precedent-setting court case that began Tuesday may shed some light on the issue.

Gregory Alan Elliott was charged with three counts of criminal harassment and one count of breaching a peace bond after repeatedly sending Twitter messages to three women that allegedly made them fear for their safety.

The first woman to go to the police was Stephanie Guthrie, a local activist who tweets prolifically about feminism and Toronto politics.

Guthrie had met Elliott via Twitter when looking for someone to design posters for a group she founded, “Women in TO politics.” They met once in person, and Guthrie later told the investigating officer Det. Jeff Bangild that she felt “seedy” just sitting across from him, court heard Tuesday.
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She then discovered that Elliott had a history of sending tweets she considered sexually harassing and offensive to women, and decided not hire him. In the months that followed Guthrie told the Star she received several harassing tweets from Elliott, and finally went to the police in November 2012.

After Elliott was charged with criminal harassment on Nov. 21, two of Guthrie’s fellow political-feminist Twitter users Heather Reilly and Paisley Rae came forward and two more charges were laid in January 2013.

Rae told Bangild that it was “exhausting” being regularly tweeted at with the hashtag “#fascistfeminist,” Elliott’s defence lawyer Chris Murphy told the court.

However, Murphy contends that the complainants also engaged in hurtful behaviour on Twitter by using the hashtag “#GAEhole” to refer to Elliott. Elliott’s lawyer also questioned how the women were still being harassed by tweets from Elliott when they blocked him on Twitter.

When asked by Murphy whether he investigated any tweets with that hashtag, Bangild said that he didn’t consider it relevant since the victims of harassment can respond in many different ways.

Bangild told the court that he did not find any tweets from Elliott that threatened to harm any of the three women.

Elliott’s Twitter account, which describes him as a “Toronto artist, 4 adult sons. Designer, poet, lover, friend” has been inactive since he was arrested.

Criminal harassment is in part defined by the criminal code as “repeatedly communicating with, either directly or indirectly, the other person or anyone known to them” in a way that causes them to fear for their safety.

Guthrie is no stranger to the dark side of Twitter. After tweeting in support of American feminist and gamer Anita Sarkeesian in 2012, Guthrie became the target of death and rape threats.

Christie Blatchford, a level headed columnist at the National Post had two interesting articles on the trial

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2014...ame-cloth/

http://fullcomment.nationalpost.com/2014...tterverse/

Stephanie Guthrie's twitter, if any of you want to be charged with criminal harassment: https://twitter.com/amirightfolks

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01-11-2014 04:13 AM
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Handsome Creepy Eel Offline
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" Twitter Feminists
Quote:Guthrie is no stranger to the dark side of Twitter. After tweeting in support of American feminist and gamer Anita Sarkeesian in 2012, Guthrie became the target of death and rape threats.

This is the obligatory playing-the-victim note at the end of every article that is designed to make feminists look like heroes who are doing what they are doing in spite of real danger. See, she received "threats" for supporting a destructive lunatic! She must be a hero!

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01-11-2014 04:53 AM
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" Twitter Feminists
You know what?

These retards don't know "darker sides."

The stronger the jail cell, the greater the inmate. I know the dark side.

These dip-shits are just water-testing.

Water-testing in a wading-pool. They don't engage real, substantive handles and only engage the trolls -- to shore up their psyche -- and worshipful handles.

It's all about them.

Old Chinese Man Wrote:  why you wonder how many man another man bang? why you care who bang who mr high school drama man
01-11-2014 05:16 AM
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Sp5 Offline
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" Twitter Feminists
Strange case. Once again, thank God and Jefferson that we have a First Amendment in the USA.

I blame the prosecutor, the cop even testified he would not have brought the charges. Odd thing is, when I looked the prosecuror up, Marnie Goldenberg, the only links were to a "sexplainer" who also has a law degree.

Very strange and perhaps even worse than it looks at first glance.
01-11-2014 05:49 AM
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Jackreacher Offline
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" Twitter Feminists
Joe: Hey what are you in for?
Bob: Burglary with a firearm. You?
Joe: Tweeting with intent to cause emotional harm to women.
Bob: You horrible misogynist!
01-11-2014 06:14 AM
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" Twitter Feminists
fucking Canada. Dief the chief must be spinning in his grave. It is such a country of contrasts with outrageous stories of PC crime in the cities while the strength of the country and it economy are built on primary resource sectors like oil, gas, mining and forestry which employ the most Un-PC cave man guys you have ever met. Its a conflict of cultures that can't last forever.

looking for a new signature.
01-11-2014 06:21 AM
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" T...
(01-11-2014 06:21 AM)wiscanada Wrote:  fucking Canada. Dief the chief must be spinning in his grave. It is such a country of contrasts with outrageous stories of PC crime in the cities while the strength of the country and it economy are built on primary resource sectors like oil, gas, mining and forestry which employ the most Un-PC cave man guys you have ever met. Its a conflict of cultures that can't last forever.

Ya, I'm jumping ship.

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01-11-2014 12:01 PM
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Parlay44 Offline
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" Twitter Feminists
Social media is about spewing your opinions to the world but directing them at someone is harassment. This is why the internet will fail.

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01-11-2014 12:10 PM
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Glock Offline
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" T...
Part of the evidence against the defendant is that he was nice to her by offering to give her a ride and offering to pick up the tab for their lunch meeting:

Quote:Mr. Elliott offered to pick up the tab; she refused. He repeatedly offered her a drive home; she refused. But, she agreed, he made no physical passes; he didn’t threaten her; said nothing remotely sexual.

“His harassment of me,” Ms. Guthrie sniffed, “wasn’t sexual in nature, and that’s important to note.”

But his thrice-offered drive, she said, was “a violation of my boundaries,” which she’d taken care to draw.

It is now clear that if you are even polite to feminists, you are risking their ire. This man's kindness was introduced as evidence against him in support of criminal charges!

Worse, his kindness is being presented as violative of the subjective, personal "boundaries" of a woman he doesn't know, and who never explained those "boundaries." Are men now required to read minds?

This is simply unbelievable.
(This post was last modified: 01-11-2014 12:36 PM by Glock.)
01-11-2014 12:32 PM
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" T...
(01-11-2014 12:10 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  Social media is about spewing your opinions to the world but directing them at someone is harassment. This is why the internet will fail.

Look at how the social media craze has begun to slow down. I agree with you, the internet is slowly failing. Never mind the whole NSA surveillance, if you live in the US... it's only another reason why the internet is becoming more of a waste of time.
01-11-2014 12:32 PM
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" T...
(01-11-2014 12:32 PM)Truth Teller Wrote:  
(01-11-2014 12:10 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  Social media is about spewing your opinions to the world but directing them at someone is harassment. This is why the internet will fail.

Look at how the social media craze has begun to slow down. I agree with you, the internet is slowly failing. Never mind the whole NSA surveillance, if you live in the US... it's only another reason why the internet is becoming more of a waste of time.

Said the man on an online forum message board.
(This post was last modified: 01-11-2014 01:02 PM by Glock.)
01-11-2014 01:02 PM
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" T...
(01-11-2014 01:02 PM)Consul Wrote:  
(01-11-2014 12:32 PM)Truth Teller Wrote:  
(01-11-2014 12:10 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  Social media is about spewing your opinions to the world but directing them at someone is harassment. This is why the internet will fail.

Look at how the social media craze has begun to slow down. I agree with you, the internet is slowly failing. Never mind the whole NSA surveillance, if you live in the US... it's only another reason why the internet is becoming more of a waste of time.

Said the man on an online forum message board.

This forum is different from Facebook. Anymonimity allows free speech without fear of reprisal. I believe it's necessary. It stimulates people to think instead of being overly sensitive politically correct sheep.

Team Nachos
01-11-2014 01:09 PM
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Daddy Offline
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" T...
Did he really harass her, or did they start a back and forth argument, then upon seeing she was losing it, she went to cry to the police? It's hard to tell what really happened.

However, I googled her name and this picture came up :

[Image: guthrie.jpg]

I invite you to pay attention to her awesome square jaw. Damn I bet that girl can take a hit.
01-11-2014 02:41 PM
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blkgatsby Offline
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" T...
Too bad this wasn't in the USA , or else he could have sued for denying his freedom of speech.
01-11-2014 03:03 PM
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" Twitter Feminists
Hurting someone feelings = rape.
01-11-2014 04:00 PM
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" Twitter Feminists
ROK should have a #fascistfeminist week

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01-11-2014 04:48 PM
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" T...
I'm really getting sick of hearing about "death threats" made online... This is the biggest non-issue ever.
How much effort does it require for some idiot to sit in their basement and anonymously type "I'm going to kill you"? How can you legitimately be threatened by that?
01-11-2014 04:59 PM
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" T...
(01-11-2014 01:02 PM)Consul Wrote:  
(01-11-2014 12:32 PM)Truth Teller Wrote:  
(01-11-2014 12:10 PM)Parlay44 Wrote:  Social media is about spewing your opinions to the world but directing them at someone is harassment. This is why the internet will fail.

Look at how the social media craze has begun to slow down. I agree with you, the internet is slowly failing. Never mind the whole NSA surveillance, if you live in the US... it's only another reason why the internet is becoming more of a waste of time.

Said the man on an online forum message board.

I hardly consider this social media, and for the most part, the internet is a waste of time. There are a few sites worth looking at and a few things worth paying attention to. There are many sites out there that have no purpose at all.
01-11-2014 05:10 PM
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" T...
We're almost at the one year anniversary of 9 ugliest feminists in America, maybe it's time for a refresh. While this one's Canadian, she certainly fits the grade, both body and soul.

And then there's her boyfriend, they're clearly meant for each other. Why are these people always such caricatures hitting all the stereotypes? http://instagram.com/thomasjohnd

The things she's saying, the extreme hypocrisy and mental disconnect in what she says and does, I just... I can't.

Mindblown

Trials are usually open to the public, aren't they? I wouldn't mind attending, and at least being there for the not guilty verdict.
01-11-2014 05:16 PM
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" T...
(01-11-2014 04:59 PM)Ziltoid Wrote:  How much effort does it require for some idiot to sit in their basement and anonymously type "I'm going to kill you"? How can you legitimately be threatened by that?

In a culture where pinting a finger at somebody and going "pew-pew" is grounds for arrest, it seems to be quite serious.
01-11-2014 06:59 PM
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gfly Offline
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" Twitter Feminists
fuck the internet. I'm going back to cb radio/sarcasm
01-11-2014 07:25 PM
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" Twitter Feminists
Not guilty.

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2016/0...verse.html

"Not-guilty ruling sets up framework for Twitter cases

Gregory Elliott harassed two women through tweets, but not to the level of criminality, the judge says in a ruling that took four hours to read.

In a heavily scrutinized and historic ruling, lauded by some and lamented by others, a Toronto court has delved into the frenzied realm of Twitter to grapple with questions of online expression and comments gone too far.
The result left some with the hope that there is now at least a framework to deal with alleged harassment by tweeting."


http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada...dian-first
01-23-2016 12:59 AM
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Last Parade Offline
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RE: Man charged with criminal harassment after pissing off & "creepin" Twitter Feminists
Damn, I posted in this thread two years ago, don't even remember it... ha, I noted the 9 ugliest feminists in America, based on Roosh's trip last year and all the recent developments in the cesspool of Toronto we could definitely do a 9 ugliest feminists in Canada! I'll need to get to work on that.

Funny thing is I was contemplating going to see the not guilty verdict, which I had 99.999% confidence in happening, but today just wasn't a good day for it.

I'd love if there was some afterthought on this such as:

-Why were bail conditions (no internet usage) so unbelievably restrictive? Wouldn't "no twitter usage & no contacting the plaintiffs" be enough???
-Why did this even go to trial in the first place? are you fucking kidding me, justice system?
-Did anyone ever point out to her that this all started from her and her friends criminally harassing somebody? What they did should be a crime on the books - and is, as far as I'm concerned.
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2016 01:49 AM by Last Parade.)
01-23-2016 01:45 AM
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Hope for free speech in Canada! Elliott not guilty.
Apologies to the membership for my much delayed mega-post on freedom of speech in Canada.

One reason is that I have been so bloody busy with the business since the Summer (which I am humbly thankful for as so many of my fellow Albertans are out of work).

The second reason was that I was waiting for a decision in the trial of Gregory Elliott. An analysis of this decision was (and is) going to conclude my piece as a sign and portend of the future.

Looks like the future may be more bright than I had initially thought.

Elliott was charged with "criminal harassment" for hurling insults back and forth on Twitter with a couple feminists/social justice warriors (one of whom was connected with the police). Of course only he got charged despite the tactics and language used by the "victims" being in some cases more deplorable.

He was charged all the way back in 2012 and spent the very protracted and expensive period attempting to fight these charges.

Yesterday the Ontario Court of Justice acquitted him.

As the National Post writes:
http://news.nationalpost.com/news/canada...dian-first

Quote:The nature of social media and freedom of expression were front and centre Friday when a judge found a Toronto man not guilty of criminal harassment on Twitter.

Gregory Alan Elliott was cleared of two charges of criminal harassment that stemmed from his Twitter interactions with two Toronto women’s rights activists. Judge Brent Knazan’s lengthy decision dwelled on both the nature of Twitter and freedom of expression in a ruling that is among the first in Canada.

Elliott was cleared, in part, because — though the judge noted his words were sometimes “insulting and homophobic” — his tweets were not considered overtly sexually or physically threatening.

Stephanie Guthrie and Heather Reilly accused Elliott of harassment partly based on his use of hashtags — a word, acronym or phrase after a number symbol used to create trackable conversations — they used. It was an assertion the judge found contrary to the open nature of Twitter. He said the pair may have felt harassed, but he couldn’t prove Elliott knew they felt that way, nor did the content of his tweets include explicitly threatening language.

Knazan also discussed the link between Twitter and freedom of expression. People must “tolerate the annoyance” of oppositional views as part of that Charter right,

Freedom of expression represents society’s commitment to tolerate the annoyance of being confronted by unacceptable views…One man’s vulgarity is another man’s lyric,” he said, quoting from Robert Sharpe and Kent Roach’s book the Charter of Rights and Freedoms.

The judge also noted a lack of “reasonableness” in Guthrie’s assertion she could expect to use Twitter to make negative comments about Elliott and not be exposed to his response or self defence.

The Post has a link up so you can read the entire judgment (which is unusual for Canadian print media).

It is 88 pages and will require more in-depth analysis for my forthcoming piece, but here are some highlights that I find very encouraging:

Quote:Twitter is a public forum; Ms. Guthrie compared it to a public square. You can communicate privately on it, and people do, but it is difficult. If you simply tweet, anyone who follows you can read it and anyone who doesn’t follow you can read it on the internet so long as they have a twitter account and yours is not private. If you address the tweet to someone by putting their handle first in the tweet, not only they will see it but those who follow their feed can see it as a tweet that they receive. If you mention someone’s handle in the text, then they will be notified even if the tweet is to someone else.

...

Twitter is a powerful medium and gives an individual the potential to communicate with many people as if that individual had access to the mass media. As such, the individual has certain responsibilities, and must act within the law, as Mr. Elliott is charged with failing to do. However, the individual also enjoys a constitutional right to freedom of expression.

...

Twitter not only expands access to readers to those who do not have access to the mass media, it is an alternative to the mass media. It has the potential to develop so that more and different points of view can be promoted, including those that are not reflected in traditional media. Since tweets can include links, I can conclude, just from the evidence, that Twitter can spread well-considered articles as well as the tweeter’s opinion. Any limitation on its use that is not necessary to prevent criminality will limit this potential. It will not be consistent with the freedom of expression that is essential to a free and democratic society.

...

The essence of Twitter and hashtags, as the limited evidence in this case demonstrates, is to facilitate communication between people with like interests who voluntarily choose to follow certain topics or people and see what is being said about and by them. If you can’t use hashtags – whatever hashtags you want and no matter who created them – then you can’t use the platform to its potential.

Even with respect to tweeting in general, using Twitter while being protected from seeing another person’s tweets or having them see and comment on yours is unworkable. You can limit seeing another person’s tweets by blocking them, by not opening another person’s feed and by asking your friends not to retweet tweets from people you have blocked. And you can avoid reading their replies by not writing to them. But if you tweet with hashtags and follow hashtags, you are going to see every tweet that contains those hashtags, and anyone who wants can follow them. A blocker can choose to avoid seeing tweets with hashtags they follow from someone they have blocked, but they lose the benefit of the hashtag discussion by that choice.

...

And I do not accept that blocking someone or telling them that you blocked them a month ago communicates that you are harassed. Ms. Guthrie was not harassed on July 7, yet she blocked him. There can be many reasons for not wanting to read someone’s tweets. In this case, as I will discuss, it was in part because Ms. Guthrie thought what Mr. Elliott had to say was worthless nonsense. This may be understandable, but is not equivalent to advising someone that you are harassed.

...

Ms. Guthrie asked in testimony, “What did it matter that he had a valid point? Who cares?” I interpret this evidence, with the help of her explanation, as meaning that even if he had a valid point it did not permit him to stalk and harass her. In that sense, she is correct: you are not permitted to repeatedly communicate a valid point to someone when you know that they are harassed if it would cause them to reasonably fear for their safety in all of the circumstances.

But in another sense, important to the determination of this charge, Ms. Guthrie is not correct. If he had a valid point, he was entitled to use the hashtags that she had created and mention her, as he would not know that she was harassed by his expressing views in opposition to hers or her friends’. This is particularly the case regarding any issue about which Ms. Guthrie had herself engaged.

It goes further. He did not have to have a valid opinion in her view or even an opinion that was not spurious in her view. He could, in the tradition of Canadian freedom of expression that I discussed above, have a controversial or even offensive opinion. He could use extreme, hyperbolic, provocative language such as “fascist feminists.” He could be, and unfortunately was, homophobic and insulting.

Mr. Elliott’s view, as emerges from the content of his proven tweets, is that he could write what he wanted. His view conforms to the Twitter rules and the Canadian value of freedom of expression. If that was his state of mind, then he would not know that Ms. Guthrie was harassed by his doing what was lawful and what the platform they were both using permitted. What was lawful remained lawful; it does not amount to a crime unless the person communicating knows that the other person is harassed.

...

The proper use of Twitter is complicated, as it is developing. One view is Mr. Elliott’s as expressed in tweets such as, “You don’t know the value of twitter. If you want a private conversation use email,” and tweets expressing the importance of allowing others to tweet even if you think their opinions have no validity and are garbage. Ms. Guthrie’s view is the opposite. Though she testified that Mr. Elliott had a right to give his opinion, she took the position that she could demand that she be excluded from receiving it, which is her right – but also that he had to comply and cooperate, which is not her right.

...

Each aspect of his tweeting is legitimate. To repeat, tweeting on a topic and exercising freedom of expression, arguing facts about his history with Ms. Guthrie (possibly falsely regarding his having no sexual interest), exercising and expressing his opinion on the proper use of the medium that everyone was using, is permitted.

...

To argue this tweet as a sample of criminal harassment does not advance the proposition that Mr. Elliott knew Ms. Guthrie was harassed; it raises doubt as to whether he knew or not. It comes back to the two understandably different ways that Mr. Elliott and Ms. Guthrie viewed the whole affair.

His volume of tweets harassed her because of her view that she could control people’s non-threatening, non-sexual use of her handle and hashtags that she used beyond not reading their tweets and taking the ineffectual step of blocking. He cannot be imputed with knowledge that Ms. Guthrie was harassed by his tweeting. Mr. Elliott was not responsible for that view, which is at least arguably incompatible with Twitter.

...

It is reasonable that fear can arise just from the fact of someone continuing to contact someone after being asked to stop. That behaviour could reasonably signify that the person who continued the contact was capable of anything since they ignored the request. Findings of reasonable fear are made on just that basis; I have done so myself in criminal harassment trials.

But in this case, Ms. Guthrie’s unreasonable premise that Mr. Elliott was irrational and had nothing valid to say meant that she never put his tweets into any context. The very fact of his tweeting any hashtag she followed or any tweet about her or with her handle harassed her.
She would not even allow for the possibility that he had any reason apart from the obsession with her that he perceived to tweet about her. Given that she had a leadership role in the campaign to denounce him, that is not reasonable.

I do not restrict this consideration to physical safety, as s. 264 can include psychological safety. Though Crown counsel argued that as a basis of Ms. Guthrie’s fear, I did not interpret her fear of danger to mean that. She particularly cited his knowing the neighbourhood in which she lived, and there is no evidence that she feared for her psychological safety. But that fear must also be reasonable.

I admit I was expecting Elliott to be convicted. From the Battle of Toronto to the election of increasingly politically correct leftist governments here in Canada, every indication was that freedom of speech was dying a slow but inevitable death here.

This ruling gives me some genuine hope.

There are still some issues here. The Judge found that "recklessness" as to whether a SJW feels harassed by a tweet or series of them will be sufficient to make out that element of the offence. There is also some clear white-knighting language in the judgment and insufficient denunciation of the bad behaviour of the "victims" (although some recognition that Elliott could take actions in Twitter to defend himself from their character assaults on him).

The most important thing to me is that the Judge found that given the nature of Twitter as an open platform and the fundamental importance of freedom of expression as a Canadian constitutional right, it was totally unreasonable of the "victims" to feel harassed. Whether they felt subjectively harassed is insufficient. A reasonable person in the context of an open platform for speech has no objective basis to feel harassed by someone expressing an opposing viewpoint, even if it is expressed offensively. This is the crux of the ruling and the victory for free speech.

I will of course analyze further and in more detail the implications of this ruling for my mega-piece, but for once I see reason to be optimistic that the tyranny of the politically correct may not be total and that the counterfeit "human right" not to have one's feelings hurt or beliefs challenged could be on the decline.

TL;DR: a Canadian male Twitter troll was actually acquitted of "harassing" internet feminists because he has the right to disagree with them and disagree offensively. There may be hope for freedom of speech in Canada after all.

Just a human enjoying his "Apex-Predator Privilege" atop the food chain.
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2016 01:10 PM by DannyAlberta.)
01-23-2016 01:09 PM
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Nemausus Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Hope for free speech in Canada! Elliott not guilty.
I was glad to see this ruling come across the news yesterday. A good day for Canada.

I can't believe it took them years to sort through this case. A photo of the two principals side by side tells you all you need to know about this story:

[Image: twitterverdict.jpg.size.xxlarge.letterbox.jpg]

This Stephanie Guthrie gremlin is a SJW/feminist cliché.

Looking forward to your datasheet, Danny.
(This post was last modified: 01-23-2016 01:20 PM by Nemausus.)
01-23-2016 01:17 PM
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