Post: #1

An extremely intense blog details the thoughts and motivations of a man who decided to commit suicide.

His name was Martin Manley.

http://martinmanley.org/index2.html

Quote:SUICIDE PREFACE

I know the question you are asking. "Why did you want to die? ... or Why didn't you want to live?" Here is the answer. I didn't want to die. If I could have waved a magic wand and lived for 200 years, I would have. Unfortunately, that's not an option. Therefore, since death is inevitable, the better question is... do I want to live as long as humanly possible OR do I want to control the time and manner and circumstances of my death? That was my choice (and yours). I chose what was most appealing to me.

Let me ask you a question. After you die, you can be remembered by a few-line obituary for one day in a newspaper when you're too old to matter to anyone anyway... OR you can be remembered for years by a site such as this. That was my choice and I chose the obvious.

Manley raises the obvious point - we are all going to die, the only question is how. Why not by your own hand, and in a way that lets the world remember who you were as a man?

Quote:I always thought I might commit suicide someday. When I considered the options of living to be old and all the negatives associated with that alternative, I knew there was no way on earth I was going to allow myself to deal with such an intolerable situation. In order to guarantee that I avoided it, I also knew that I had to commit the act before I was incapacitated and unable to carry it out.

The thought of being in a nursing home, physically or mentally disabled, was the single scariest thing I had ever thought about - at least on this earth. So, in order to make sure that it never happened, I determined that I would have to end things when I was still semi-intelligent and physically able. That’s what I mean by saying “Because I can.”

It’s also true that I wanted to leave on top. What does “on top” mean?

[...]

The apt analogy is that I've run the race. I already got to the finish line. I didn't croak on the way. I didn't get embarrassed. I didn't break a leg. I sprinted most of the time and sometimes I slowed to a walk to catch my breath. But, I could see the finish line and I liked it!! The last thing on Earth I was going to do when I got there was... keep going. I completed the race because I went over every hurdle that was in my way. Sometimes I fell. But, I got back up and ran that much harder. Perhaps your finish line is a little farther off in the distance than mine. I don't know. I only know I reached mine and when I got there the only thing I wanted to do was rest. And, so I shall.

Manley understood he had reached the apex of his life, and he would only face obsolescence and degeneration from there on. He had no wife (divorced twice), no kids, and none of his brothers or sisters had any children either. He had no more real attachments to the world and nothing else to live for.

And, at the age of 60, he knew his time was coming to an end. He could feel the decay.

Quote:I began seeing the problems that come with aging some time ago. I was sick of leaving the garage door open overnight. I was sick of forgetting to zip up when I put on my pants. I was sick of forgetting the names of my best friends. I was sick of going downstairs and having no idea why. I was sick of watching a movie, going to my account on IMDB to type up a review and realizing I've already seen it and, worse, already written a review! I was sick of having to dig through the trash to find an envelope that was sent to me so I could remember my own address - especially since I lived in the same place for the last nine years!

He could feel himself losing his mind - the most valuable thing a man has - and knew his diagnosis was grim.

Since Danger and Play posted a link to this blog in his twitter feed, I must have spent over six cumulative hours reading every word he left behind, mesmerized by it's cold rationality and it's warm vivid descriptions of his childhood, first loves, and two marriages. I read through his failures and successes as a man, and I saw myself reflected back through Manley as an agent capable of controlling my destiny.

Lost amidst the moral discussions of whether or not suicide is an acceptable action is the incontrovertible evidence of free will; there is no animal in the world that can recognize it's impending death due to the natural aging process and end it not out of fear, not out of suffering, but out of the self-love that comes with respecting the greatness we all have as able-bodied men. The sublime act of calculated suicide reveals the power of the human spirit in front of the greatest adversity of them all, time itself, and where we can tell fate,

"Although I did not choose to be born here, or my instincts regarding survival and reproduction, or the emotions which determine my personality, or the physical features that grant me power, or my family or society that raised me, I can choose when I shall leave this mortal coil. It is the one thing that separates a man from a beast, and demonstrates that our reason, which is unnatural to all things, elevates us to the power of God."

Martin Manley blew his head off with a .308 pistol in a police station parking lot on August 15, 2013. Rest in peace, Martin Manley. You will be remembered as a great man, even though your most significant act was explaining your death.

Post: #2

While in theory I'm all for calculated suicide, this guy's case is just sad. 60 is pretty young by my standards. My dad is 68 and in awesome shape, still surfs, he's looking forward to the next 20 years of his life (knock on wood)

I would have to be suffering pretty badly to commit to eternal darkness. I don't believe in any afterlife or continuing consciousness. As bittersweet and downright depressing life can be sometimes, I can't imagine willingly depriving myself of another sunset, or sunrise, or spending the night with a girl. Hell even at that age, I'd still get a thrill from chasing prostitutes. Never again would you indulge in a glass of fine red wine, of 100 year old cognac, never again listen to Mahler's 9th, or Beethoven or Liszt or Chopin or Mendelssohn. No more sublime meals with good friends, laughing about old times. Never again take a road trip along the California coastline, go camping, meditate out in nature, wallow in natural hot springs or swimming holes.

I could go on forever, I could never willingly take life from myself unless I was experiencing extreme misery. What this guy describes does not sound like misery, just quirks of getting old.

Even if I did decide it was time to go, I'd rather risk my life doing something crazy than blow my brains out with a gun. Go skydiving on acid while naked and staring straight at the sun or something.

Post: #3

(08-27-2013 11:42 PM)thedude3737 Wrote:  Go skydiving on acid while naked and staring straight at the sun or something.

^^^^^I need to party with this guy

Post: #4

This is kind of like Hunter Thompson(also shot himself) who killed himself before his health got the better of him. His suicide note:

Quote:No More Games. No More Bombs. No More Walking. No More Fun. No More Swimming. 67. That is 17 years past 50. 17 more than I needed or wanted. Boring. I am always bitchy. No Fun – for anybody. 67. You are getting Greedy. Act your old age. Relax – This won’t hurt.

go to 1 minute mark (below)

Post: #5

This is terrible that he's only 60 and did this.

My father is over the age of 60, and thankfully, still of totally sound mind and body. He exercises regularly, has been a pescatarian since college, still routinely rocks younger guys on the basketball court with his hook shot, and still has all his mental facilities.

I have seen other 60 year olds who have not lived healthy. They look like they're dying. Hunched over, suffering heart attacks, wrinked up, mentally dull. I don't know perhaps my father had "good genes" or was "lucky" but I think his dedication to exercise and a healthy diet has really helped him live a fulfilling life that continues to be worth living. Of his parents, his mother died relatively early, and his father lived for a long time but only thanks to multiple gastric bypass surgeries. My father has had surgeries on his hips and knees, but nothing life-threatening so far has affected him.

This makes me want to get even healthier, I can't imagine being younger than my father and killing yourself because your mind is already being lost...

Post: #6

Roissy put this on twitter the other day and I remember reading through some of it. The guy definitely wasn't stupid and had a good sense of what he was getting into and leaving behind whether you agree with his motivations or not.

Quote:"Although I did not choose to be born here, or my instincts regarding survival and reproduction, or the emotions which determine my personality, or the physical features that grant me power, or my family or society that raised me, I can choose when I shall leave this mortal coil. It is the one thing that separates a man from a beast, and demonstrates that our reason, which is unnatural to all things, elevates us to the power of God."

I'm not religious at all, but since ancient times man has tried to become "like the gods". Don't we all strive for those moments when we can become something more than a walking, talking sack of meat? We all have to find our way to those moments, but I also believe it's one of the reasons we're here.

Winston Churchill said it best: "We are all worms. But I believe that I am a glow-worm."

Post: #7

(08-28-2013 12:01 AM)Vitriol Wrote:  I'm not religious at all, but since ancient times man has tried to become "like the gods". Don't we all strive for those moments when we can become something more than a walking, talking sack of meat? We all have to find our way to those moments, but I also believe it's one of the reasons we're here.

How do you become more than a sack of meat by murdering yourself?

Isn't a rotting sack of meat less than a fresh sack? Or a heap of detritus rather less than a living creature?

Moreover, in the absence of religion there is no reason why we're here apart from whatever the individual arbitrarily comes up with.

Post: #8

(08-27-2013 11:56 PM)Sonsowey Wrote:  This is terrible that he's only 60 and did this.

My father is over the age of 60, and thankfully, still of totally sound mind and body. He exercises regularly, has been a pescatarian since college, still routinely rocks younger guys on the basketball court with his hook shot, and still has all his mental facilities.

I have seen other 60 year olds who have not lived healthy. They look like they're dying. Hunched over, suffering heart attacks, wrinked up, mentally dull. I don't know perhaps my father had "good genes" or was "lucky" but I think his dedication to exercise and a healthy diet has really helped him live a fulfilling life that continues to be worth living. Of his parents, his mother died relatively early, and his father lived for a long time but only thanks to multiple gastric bypass surgeries. My father has had surgeries on his hips and knees, but nothing life-threatening so far has affected him.

This makes me want to get even healthier, I can't imagine being younger than my father and killing yourself because your mind is already being lost...

I'll do you one better. My dad is 65, was diagnosed with bone cancer 15 years ago and given six months to live. Since his childhood he drank like a fish, smoked a pack a day, and used hard drugs. He is still living. Came to visit me. He's beat up. Can barely walk up the hill to my apartment. His mind is slipping. He speaks slowly. Moves slowly.

But he is still *alive.* I introduced him to a couple of the women in my life. His mind is slipping, but he still knows nice eyes, nice skin, nice ass, nice tits. I took him to Joshua Tree. He'd never seen it. Hard to show that motherfucker something he'd not seen in this country. He's been all over. But this was new. He had trouble walking. Had trouble speaking. But every new bird, every new rock, every new flower blew his mind. When night fell, every new star-- there is so much to see in this life. So much to know.

Of course, the old man was also deeply interested in the 19 year old Hong Kong chick walking on our hiking trail. Son, you better make a move on that. She's interested. Tell her to take your picture.

You will lose your mind, your body, your dick-- whatever you value. But life still has things to show you. Life isn't done with you. I get why people kill themselves. I get it, but they're wrong. Seeing a god damn road runner drinking from a mud puddle changes my life every time. And it changed the life of a 65 year old man who I'd thought had seen everything. You could live for a thousand years and never run out of wonderful shit.

I get why people kill themselves. I contemplate it every day. Still: don't. It's an arrogant thing to do. It's saying: I know all the secrets. Bullshit. You never know. Tomorrow a seagull could steal a kid's ice cream cone in front of you and you'll laugh harder and better than you ever have in your life.

Post: #9

(08-28-2013 12:16 AM)Therapsid Wrote:  Moreover, in the absence of religion there is no reason why we're here apart from whatever the individual arbitrarily comes up with.

Yes, I know. This fucker arbitrarily came up with this:

Quote:Let me ask you a question. After you die, you can be remembered by a few-line obituary for one day in a newspaper when you're too old to matter to anyone anyway... OR you can be remembered for years by a site such as this. That was my choice and I chose the obvious.

So where is the problem? Would we have all been inherently better off if he stayed alive another 10 years watching the Price is Right and Lone Ranger reruns while decaying on a couch? He tried to become something better than he was at that time. None of us can know how posterity will judge us when we breathe our last breath.

Post: #10

(08-27-2013 11:42 PM)thedude3737 Wrote:  I would have to be suffering pretty badly to commit to eternal darkness.

It's tricky business, man.

Your dad might be fine now, but there will come a time when he's not. My grandma was fine until about 80. Then it was a fast downhill slide.

There's a line between knowing your'e losing your faculties and then it being too late to use those faculties to kill yourself.

The guy actually addresses that point. He noted that he could feel himself losing it and wanted to take action before he would not be able to.

I watched my grandma crouch into dementia. It was heartbreaking to me.

She asked me to help kill herself. Knowing I would, my family immediately had her put into an old folks' home. She waited too long, and it was too late.

The last 3 years of her life were spent in agony, suffering pneumonia, and slowing starving to death.

She looked like a ghost when she finally died.

My grandma was the kind of woman who makes me hate feminists. She raised 3 children while working in a factory and taking care of a home and husband. She kept the family together. She never cried about "work life balance" or the patriarchy.

She was a legitimately strong, independent woman. But this proud, strong woman died weighing less than 80 pounds and wearing diapers.

Rather than celebrate her life and giving her some poison in a glass of wine, my family fucking tortured her.

There's no fucking way in the world I'm going to wait for nature to take its course. I will die with dignity. If I'm losing it at 60, I'll be everyone farewell. If I'm fortunate to make it to 80 or 90, great.

But there's no way that selfish family members will be allowed to make me suffer simply because they are too emotionally weak to let go and say goodbye.

Post: #11

(08-28-2013 12:30 AM)delicioustacos Wrote:  You will lose your mind, your body, your dick-- whatever you value. But life still has things to show you. Life isn't done with you. I get why people kill themselves. I get it, but they're wrong. Seeing a god damn road runner drinking from a mud puddle changes my life every time. And it changed the life of a 65 year old man who I'd thought had seen everything. You could live for a thousand years and never run out of wonderful shit.

I get why people kill themselves. I contemplate it every day. Still: don't. It's an arrogant thing to do. It's saying: I know all the secrets. Bullshit. You never know. Tomorrow a seagull could steal a kid's ice cream cone in front of you and you'll laugh harder and better than you ever have in your life.

That was fucking beautiful man

Post: #12

I can tell a lot of the people here who are arguing against suicide do not understand senility.

Manley couldn't remember his own address and would need to dig through his trashcan to find letters with his address on it. Did you guys read the story? Manley was degrading fast.

Your brain dies before your body dies. When the brain dies, so does your nervous system and consciousness. No one has the slightest clue what causes the brain to stay alive or not. But when it goes, you're done.

Death is inevitable. The greatest thing a man can do is learn how to die.

Post: #13

^ Yep.

One summer I babysat a man with Alzheimer's for a family friend.

He was a Korean War vet who had to be reminded to take a piss. Otherwise he would pee his pants.

His son would have to give him a shower at night because this once proud man would shit his pants.

Guys can make all the arguments against suicide that they want. One day spent in an old folk's home with people who shit themselves, reek, have bed sores from not getting enough exercise...then we'll see.

"A page of experience is worth more than a volume of logic."

Post: #14

"I felt like he was up there waiting for me to take the pain away. He just wanted to go out like a soldier.. standing up"





Would you rather wither away in a nursing home? Slowly losing your mind?

Post: #15

I wrote a couple months ago, maybe 3 that my grandfather died. He was an amazing person WW2 Marine Corp Vet, Chemical Engineer, super smart, stayed pretty fit his whole life, and the last 10 years of his life were basically miserable with him a prisoner of his own body. My mother was with him when he died and she was telling me it was not pretty, he struggled, was in obvious discomfort, and my mother said she wished she could shoot him to end it. It was THAT bad.

My grandmother's memory is gone. She is a very sweet lady, and I wondered if she would remember me. I just saw her and she had no idea who I was. I wasn't surprised since she no longer remembers my mother. This lady loved me so much, and now to her mind I never existed. She gets around on a walker. She said "Who are you, young fellow?" I didn't want to embarrass her so I said I was a friend of the lady that takes care of her. She shits on herself and doesn't know it.

Vets coming back from the wars often kill themselves. Some people don't understand but I do. These guys are trying to take back control over themselves, the one thing they can take control of.

In the end of this thing I think of this as a personal choice that I have to respect.

I would never say I agree with killing yourself when you have so much life left to live (even though I have considered it more than once) but, I can promise you. I'm not having someone wipe my ass for me and I'm not getting to the point where I can't remember my own family.

You own your life, It's maybe the one thing you truly can say is yours, and you have the right to do with it as you wish.

Post: #16

Kind of a dark joke, but shouldn't the thread title be "Man Creates Last Suicide Blog"?

Post: #17

Jack Kevorkian is, in my opinion, a man who had the right idea.

Post: #18

One interesting point he made, is one reason for his suicide is the impending financial collapse of the west and how terrible life will be afterwards.

$125 trillion of unfunded future liabilities.

Post: #19

(08-28-2013 02:30 AM)Hades Wrote:  Kind of a dark joke, but shouldn't the thread title be "Man Creates Last Suicide Blog"?

Nah. I think more people will create a suicide blog now that this guy came up with the template.

Post: #20

(08-28-2013 02:46 AM)Samseau Wrote:  Nah. I think more people will create a suicide blog now that this guy came up with the template.

Yeah I think you are right, we are going to start seeing more of these. This guy was the first (or first well known one) of these.

Post: #21

(08-28-2013 04:48 AM)username Wrote:  

(08-28-2013 02:46 AM)Samseau Wrote:  Nah. I think more people will create a suicide blog now that this guy came up with the template.

Yeah I think you are right, we are going to start seeing more of these. This guy was the first (or first well known one) of these.

Now that is a depressing thought, to be honest.

Given this generation's propensity towards attention whoring, I don't give this concept much time before its meaning has been diluted, if not completely corrupted by the kids you see on the news who kill themselves because someone calls them names on facebook chat.

Post: #22

Why the hell would you kill yourself in a police parking lot?
That's probably the most depressing part of this story.


It sounds like he was getting Altzheimers, which really sucks. I wonder if doctors can measure the amount of pleasure and pain Altzheimers people get. If I ever get Altzheimers, I'd probably want them to just keep me happy with drugs until I kick it.

I want to die in the saddle, or having a good time.

I sometimes get afraid to blink. I fear that one day, I'm going to blink my eyes, and open them to a reality where people I know are dead, or wake up in a hospital room with all my limbs missing or something horrific.

I do sometimes wake up from a nap and realize that people I've loved in my life are gone.

As I get older, I feel time moving much more quickly. It's slipping away.

I'm in my early thirties. When I was a kid, I thought of the 1960s as this far away time.

Now, I realize that it was only about a decade or so before I was born.

Getting older, I look at movies and pictures from that time and previous decades, and feel a deeper connection with those people (or at least the ones that look present in the photos) than when I was younger.

My sense of time is disappearing, and I'm starting to see my life a static image like a painting. It can be anxiety inducing, but also very powerful to have this god's eye perspective of your life, of the game.

To me, Death is the dissolution of meaning. People die in their lives before their heart stops beating.

Think about your life before the redpill. For me, it's gone. That guy is pretty much dead.

If you've ever bottomed out, you'll know what I'm talking about. Depression is like living a protracted death.

I think it's important that every possible avenue to relieve depression should be explored.


I've had dreams where I've died in my dreams and watched my killer eat my body or something.

Post: #23

Post: #24

Maybe I'm naive. But I didn't think people would feel their mind slipping at 60.

80? sure. Maybe even 70.

But 60? That seems very young.

Post: #25

(08-28-2013 02:33 AM)It_is_my_time Wrote:  One interesting point he made, is one reason for his suicide is the impending financial collapse of the west and how terrible life will be afterwards.

$125 trillion of unfunded future liabilities.

Really?