Post: #1

The great city of Detroit has finally filed for bankruptcy. The city is negotiating almost $20 billion in debt with creditors.

Link: Detroit files for bankruptcy protection

Quote:The bankruptcy filing makes Detroit the largest city in U.S. history to do so.

Quote:Detroit's would be by far the largest municipal bankruptcy in U.S. history, in terms of the city's population of about 700,000 and the amount of its debts and liabilities, which Orr has said could be as high as $20 billion. Because of the stakes involved, and the impact on residents statewide, as well as 30,000 current and retired city workers and Detroit's ability to stay in business, the case could be precedent setting in the federal judiciary. It could also set an important trajectory for the way troubled cities nationwide settle their financial difficulties.

Some revealing information from another article on the same topic:

Quote: Citizens wait an average 58 minutes for police to respond, and just 8.7 per cent of cases are solved. "The city's police cars, fire trucks and ambulances are so old that breakdowns make it impossible to keep up the fleet or properly carry out their roles."

Only one-third of the city's ambulances were in service in the first quarter.

Some 40 per cent of the street lights were dead in the first three months of the year.

"Large swathes of largely abandoned structures," some 78,000, are creating public safety problems.

The city has more than $18-billion in financial obligations, and even if it could raise taxes, the people can't afford to pay them.

Link: Once-great Detroit collapses, files for biggest city bankruptcy in U.S. history

Is there any hope for Detroit?

Post: #2

There is hope for Detroit, but it would take some hard nosed politically incorrect action to turn it around. Therefore it will not happen. So, there is no hope. Has a city ever completely disappeared in modern times?

Post: #3

Now they can legally end all union city contracts

Post: #4

I'm giving this 17 posts before it turns into a race thread...

Post: #5

Q: Last time Detroit had a mayor who wasn't a Democrat?
A: 1961

You'll notice the same in nearly every big city that has a high poverty rate, high crime rate, high unemployment rate, low high school graduation rate, etc.

Post: #6

(07-18-2013 05:16 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  I'm giving this 17 posts before it turns into a race thread...

I'll bet on even less.

Post: #7

Unless industry moves back in without unions there is no hope for Detroit or the Midwest.

Post: #8

What assman said.

This is what happens when you vote democrat.

Post: #9

So let me get this straight, the markets sets a new record on the same day that Detroit files for bankruptcy??

Chicago goes next, and that is going to be $100B+

Post: #10

(07-18-2013 05:38 PM)ElBorrachoInfamoso Wrote:  What assman said.

This is what happens when you vote democrat.

I think the situation with Detroit is a slightly more complex issue than that.

Post: #11

Tons of cities in America are dominated by Democratic political machines and are de facto one party municipalities. Even the union explanation seems unsatisfactory. Any number of countries have had very powerful trade unions by U.S. standards. Were unions in Detroit much more powerful than those in Britain during the Winter of Discontent in the late 70's?

Perhaps a confluence of these and other factors, like the decline of the auto industry, aftermath of the 67 Detroit riot, white flight and loss of middle class tax base, etc. can explain the city's fall.

Post: #12

(07-18-2013 05:41 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

(07-18-2013 05:38 PM)ElBorrachoInfamoso Wrote:  What assman said.

This is what happens when you vote democrat.

I think the situation with Detroit is a slightly more complex issue than that.

Losing 250000 people in a 10 year period which is tax money going bye bye could be a better reason.

Post: #13

(07-18-2013 05:55 PM)NYJ Wrote:  

(07-18-2013 05:41 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

(07-18-2013 05:38 PM)ElBorrachoInfamoso Wrote:  What assman said.

This is what happens when you vote democrat.

I think the situation with Detroit is a slightly more complex issue than that.

Losing 250000 people in a 10 year period which is tax money going bye bye could be a better reason.

Yeah and guess where all those retards end up? My backyard.

Post: #14

detroit is a wonderful city with hardworking and peaceful americans.

Post: #15

The Detroit Metro area is one of he richest in America. Places like Southfield have tons of cash swirling around.

It's not simply political. You can't just blame democrats soley, and republican would of sold out and panders to Big-Auto also.

Detroit was forced to put its eggs in one basket and that basket cracked at the worst time possible in the 70s. The rust belt cities remember stared going downhill a lot earlier and were able to use capital to a least shore up other aspects of there local economies. The 70s and 80s bled America dry for actual wealth/capital. This was he time Big-Auto decentralized and Detroit was bounded by unions and the Big Auto forms to keep things going. Once this happend people started to flee in mass, the tax left and the City lost its ability to fund and run itself properly.

The last straw was when it sunk billions of dollars into building sports arenas and Greektown thinking it would "revitalize" things. It added obscene debt numbers to thier books and shot up thier debt/bond payments.

Detorit is an example of what will happen to newer places like Vegas and Phoenix. These places grew rapidly but with no legit game plan and will see the same fate down the road.

Detorits advantage is that it's a older City that was constructed well. It has world class arts and galleries, good housing, a good downtown, and it was constructed well to drive around in. Location independent business, tech, etc all these new types of firms can set up in Detorit for dirt cheap. I've been predicting that these mid-west Places will see rebounds in time as people will seek out cheaper places to live to grow thier ventures. What good is it being raped in Boston when you could live for half he price in Detorit.

Once that gets established all that old money in the suburbs will come back in. The trend now see the melenials moving back into urban centers. You will see Detroit start to pick up agian in due time.

I have more faith in Detorit than Pheniox long term.

Post: #16

@kosko

It's crazy how much rent and other things are cheaper out in the Midwest vs the North East. Once I get a degree I am literally high tailing it out of Jersey.

Post: #17

(07-18-2013 05:55 PM)NYJ Wrote:  Losing 250000 people in a 10 year period which is tax money going bye bye could be a better reason.

This situation was predictable. You are right about flight out of the city and erosion of the tax base. The state also has a property value assessment growth cap and greatly reduced its revenue sharing with Detroit over the years. In some ways, Detroit reminded me a bit of the old south bronx, except the south bronx was subsidized by the rest of NYC.

Post: #18

If the US government wanted to save Detroit, they'd break it off of Michigan and make it a Special Economic Zone without any federal or state taxes and only a land-based tax like the system used in Hong Kong. The day after that kind of declaration would see the real estate prices in Detroit triple and within a year, it would have a population back above 1 million.

It's interesting how ideas like this have built metropolises in other nations yet we haven't thought about saving some of our cities with this method.

Post: #19

Could Detroit come back strong?

If a place hits rock bottom, it has only one way to go but up, right?

Couldn't it become some hipster/art/tech haven with people moving in because of cheap rents?

Thoughts?

Post: #20

I think they tried this already. There were some documentaries about some hipsters doing this.

Post: #21

(07-18-2013 07:29 PM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  Could Detroit come back strong?

If a place hits rock bottom, it has only one way to go but up, right?

Couldn't it become some hipster/art/tech haven with people moving in because of cheap rents?

Thoughts?

Yeah, if you're a man with a plan.

The best way to look at it is compare it to the Prairie movement of the 19th century. Americans crossing into the Louisiana purchase cuz it was for all intents and purposes.... free.

Now with native Americans hostile to incursion into the area it did come with increased risk, but as I said, it was countered by the land, for all intents and purposes.... free.

Now we have houses in Detroit going for less thsn $1,000, and of course higher risk to ones health. At that price is is pretty close to free.

But you do have the right idea, once the cost of land/shelter is materially lower and bordering on immaterial, it definately has the potential to draw young, enterprising minds.

Unlike open land, Detroit has latent infrastructure, such as fast internet, performing spaces, logistics infrastructure.

What very vew people realsie however, it like most rust belt cities is zoning, urban growth broundaries and government interference to the optimal use of land tends to be the main impediment.

Japanese car makers are making profit in other parts of the U.S., so you can't point to automaking being a dying industry.

Getting hispters/artists to a conurbation, well the comparible is Berlin. During the cold war with the cities population dwindling, it looked like West germany may have to cede it to East Germany. They pointed out land was cheap and built up performing venues and arts studios.

Buy the land yourself, and make ti available as rental at normal market rates, there's your cash cow. Your risk outlay at first is to also offer venues and galleries, then armed security to keep the risk at bay.

A critical mass would see the price of everything sky rocket.

Post: #22

I bet they blew all their money building robocop.

Post: #23

With them releasing a report saying its takes 58 minutes for cops to respond will definitely tone down the crime.

Lmfao.

Post: #24

Yeah, that seems kinda fucked that they'd publicize something like that. I'm sure nobody trusts the police already there, but basically telling people that the police are too understaffed/funded to do anything seems like shooting yourself in the dick.

I see this happening to a lot more cities in the future as manufacturing gets more and more automated.

What usually happens when a municipality goes bankrupt?

Post: #25

Quote:If the US government wanted to save Detroit, they'd break it off of Michigan and make it a Special Economic Zone without any federal or state taxes and only a land-based tax like the system used in Hong Kong. The day after that kind of declaration would see the real estate prices in Detroit triple and within a year, it would have a population back above 1 million.

Yes, this. I had the exact same idea.

Another thing that could help would be high speed rail to Toronto. It would be an easy commute.