Post: #1

I'm going to break it down how its going to happen:

As a life long U.S resident and former political news junkie, this is my prediction.

A) We are definately going over the cliff. There is no reason for either side to stop it. Democrats will get the automatic tax increases they want, and Republicans will get the spending cuts.

B) They will strike a deal in mid january.

C) Democrats will lower the rate with the compromise and claim that "they protected the middle class"

D) Republicans will claim they "saved the Economy" from the democrats destroying it.

E) Market will keep trending down until the compromise, and then will jump 2-3 hundred points on the news.

F) Market still in big trouble

What's your prediction? BTW, moved my entire 401K into cash a couple weeks ago..

Post: #2

I think this back-and-forth B.S. is mostly one big show.

Both sides know getting something passed is critical, they're just waiting to cut a last minute deal, acting tough now so their bases don't think of them as pussies for caving in.

My prediction - deal passes at the last minute. 2% social security tax holiday eliminated. Tax hikes on the wealthiest Americans will be raised. Not sure if it'll be on $250,000+ earners or what yet.

Both sides thump their chests in triumph.

Post: #3

Here is my prediction:

Post: #4

My prediction:

Post: #5

What I love is all the talk about rich people paying their fair share and protecting the middle class. Fair would be everyone pays the same percentage and if you make ten times more than someone else you pay ten times more tax.

The real hypocrisy is nobody is talking about poor people, it's all the rich and the middle class. They're basically saying "We're going to make the president of the company pay more so the vice president doesn't have to pay as much."

And they just fucking flat out refuse to reduce the fucking spending, democrats and republicans. And while we go over this fiscal cliff, a trillion dollars in new taxes 3 days from now guess what? Everyone in the federal government just got a goddamn raise.

One of my favorite lines from The Outlaw Josey Wales: Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining.

Post: #6

It's all bullshit. God forbid they get rid of some government jobs or raise the age on social security. I'm think we are going over......

Post: #7

40 hours and counting... Probably going over for a few weeks, then gloriously coming to a solution in self-congratulatory publicity stunt in mid January.

Post: #8

(12-29-2012 08:31 PM)TheCaptainPower Wrote:  It's all bullshit. God forbid they get rid of some government jobs or raise the age on social security. I'm think we are going over......

What are some useless or retarded government jobs? I always see those DC lab daters jobs and have no idea what the hell they are...

Post: #9

Post: #10

It's all a smoke show. It's all hype to confuse American's and get them upset at the wrong things (Congressmen, not their policies). This "Cliff" is nothing new but will be new is the Austerity that will be out down in the American people. UK style Austerity is coming to this side of the pond and folks are going to see noticeable tax increases while everything else from food stamps, the FDA, CPI, Highway spending will be slashed. All politicians are doing is punting whom will get to look like the Bad Guy publicly once the deal is signed. There is a reason they left it till Dec 31st. At my old job the finances expired and were turned new during their set budget period in April, the Gov is no different (whenever their reset time is). This "Cliff" date was a creation so that if needed Obama can sign in dodgy shit with everybody out getting drunk. The Tax-Cut expiration (on Dec 31st) IMO is just a smoke-screen for the tax-increases that will be handed out mostly across the board.

I agree also that nobody is talking about the poor. The 'Working Poor' make up the majority in America. The middle class is a myth, most Americans are underemployed, under-compensated, under-utilized, and under-paid. How many people here are making $65,000? per year? I know RVF has some accomplished people on here but just as a simple question I can assume many aren't in America in general. Politicians play to this because people usually reach a middle class lifestyle via debt, so they can sell to the illusion people have of them being in that class to shore up support even though in reality it makes up a very small segment of America. The rich is also placed in this bucket too. The Gov definition of 'Rich' is actually what the middle-class in reality is (when adjusted for inflation overtime). But they use them to paint all successful people as the same as the leeching 1% of folks whom won't see any increase in shit anyways. Its all a fuking sham.

(12-29-2012 08:31 PM)TheCaptainPower Wrote:  It's all bullshit. God forbid they get rid of some government jobs or raise the age on social security. I'm think we are going over......

You say this now but there is reason (aside from the politics) not to do this. The only "middle class" left in America are from public positions so a slash and burn actually makes great losses in the long run as deep-cuts always lead to bigger deficits. The American Govt makes up to large a chunk of the economy, the right idea would be shifting resources towards shit that is actually needed like infrastructure, technology-research, etc. You have to cut real waste and make things more efficient but Government always blunders this.

Post: #11

I would move social security up at least 2 or 3 years immediately, people are going to start living longer, and longer.

There are SOOO many bullshit agencies that we can cut, department of commerce, energy, education, interior. And also change their defined benefit pensions to a 401k type similar to corporate america.

Going over this cliff is going to hurt, I think they said someone making 50,000 to 100,000 is going to pay 2-4K extra in taxes. That is going to bankrupt ALOT of people.

About half my friend are living hand to mouth, especially people with kids or bad real estate.

Credit card companies are going to get killed, and student loan defaults are going to continue to rise.

Tomorrow is going to be interesting!

Captain P

Post: #12

government workers should not be able to work for 25 years and retire on 60% or up of their last year salary ask yourself who in the private sector has that right?

if people are dying at 78 on average why dont we raise the age of Social security?

people should get food stamps but should that allow them to buy shit like soda which hurts their health and ultimately makes them sicker and costlier down the line for taxpayers to pay for.

thats just a small example of shit the government does that needs to change. but sadly most americans dont think like me. the younger generation who does read and think largely understands we will NEVER have the entitlements the baby boomer generation and other generations have had. the idea social security will exisit in 40 yrs when i retire is a joke. one day the united states fisical problems WILL have to be dealt with. but Obama and congress are a joke and will continue to pass the fisical problems further down the line. so ultimately i dont think this fisical clif even if they agree to some cuts will change the massive government spending and entitlements which politicians refuse to address.

Post: #13

Whatever happens, the taxpayer is going to get screwed.

Post: #14

Hey CP I asked you something right before Samseau posted those pictures.

Post: #15

@houston

I would cut out a lot of people and resources from the department of commerce, interior, education, energy, labor etc.

I think Ron Paul suggested getting rid of them in their entirety, I would just consider cutting them back in personnel and resources.

Education should be run at the state level. I'm not even sure what the department of labor does.....

Also change the pension system for federal workers.

On entitlements you need to raise the age a couple years for social security.

Medicare is a tough one, and so is defense spending.....

Post: #16

I predict... NOTHING will happen.

Post: #17

News says they are working on a deal today, but I don't see it happening.....

I'm curious how the market will open up tomorrow without some type of deal....

Post: #18

Ahahahahahahahahah Obama just issued an executive order to increase federal salaries to the tune of $1 billion per year:

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-12-29...al-workers

New salaries for the top positions:



Old and new salaries for "regular" federal workers:




Still can't believe people voted for this clown

Post: #19

^^^LMAO. At the exact same time he signed that ... he goes and tapes this Interview which aired this morning:






People need to wake up to the fact that nobody in DC gives two fucks about them. They all are shills to Wall street and Oligarchs and will bleed every citizen's pockets dry.

This is the exact same type of shit that Carlos Saúl Menem pulled in Argentina.

Post: #20

(12-30-2012 12:40 PM)TheCaptainPower Wrote:  @houston

Medicare is a tough one, and so is defense spending.....

Medicare is a tough one, but defense spending isn't. Just slash the budget. Gary Johnson suggested cutting 43% out of it, which would still give us the largest military budget. We literally are throwing away a ton of money on defense.

Post: #21

Re-align Defense to build new infrastructure. The Army Corp of Engineers are some of the best in the world and already help with Civilian projects just apply that model to other areas of Defense. Create a industry of tech-research heavy giants that can not only do work in America but outsource their expertise around the globe.

Post: #22

Anyone think that The Chosen One will try and solve it all by executive decree? I doubt he has the Oros to do it.

Post: #23

(12-29-2012 08:18 PM)painter Wrote:  What I love is all the talk about rich people paying their fair share and protecting the middle class. Fair would be everyone pays the same percentage and if you make ten times more than someone else you pay ten times more tax.

The real hypocrisy is nobody is talking about poor people, it's all the rich and the middle class. They're basically saying "We're going to make the president of the company pay more so the vice president doesn't have to pay as much."

And they just fucking flat out refuse to reduce the fucking spending, democrats and republicans. And while we go over this fiscal cliff, a trillion dollars in new taxes 3 days from now guess what? Everyone in the federal government just got a goddamn raise.

One of my favorite lines from The Outlaw Josey Wales: Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining.

Those poor people probably wouldn't be alive without the middle class and rich people. Or if they still were they would be third world poor not third world rich.

They pay for all those single mothers to breed. You actually get more money as a single mother for each kid you pump out.

Post: #24

(12-30-2012 04:31 PM)Damedius Wrote:  They pay for all those single mothers to breed. You actually get more money as a single mother for each kid you pump out.

Yeah. A lot more. A woman with one child earns $28,327 a year in benefits.

/thread-19009-...#pid335595

Post: #25

Samseau: I'm the last one to defend DC fat cats but those wage increases hover around 0.5-1% which is significantly less than inflation in the same time period. So they are actually earning less.