Post: #226

This case of mistaken identity was painfully reminiscent of the Atlanta Olympics bombing case in 1996, when authorities fingered an innocent man, and the news media ran with it, destroying his life. Such damage was averted in Ryan Lanza’s case largely by his public protestations on social media, repeatedly declaring “It wasn’t me.”

Slate is reporting Ryan Lanza is sharing an address in Hoboken, N.J., with people named Jessica O’Brien and Michael Shapiro as housemates. Points to Ms O'Brien for quickly switching to full on Bourne Identity mode and offering "Can I set anything out for you to grab and go?"





Meanwhile a different Ryan Lanza on twitter asks, "so aperently im getting spammed bc someone with the same name as me killed some ppl... wtf?"

Post: #227

(12-16-2012 09:12 AM)sheesh Wrote:  I remember reading that at the time there were more people dying in the US through shootings than US soldiers during the war in Iraq - so the figures above could very well be correct, at least the relations between the countries.

I recall something along those lines. It was that more residents of Chicago had been killed than US servicemen in 2012. Chicago, the city with the strictest gun control in the nation.

(12-16-2012 09:12 AM)sheesh Wrote:  The gun lobby is extremely powerful and a large portion of the population is deaf and blind to a rational discussion on guns.

Actually, reading through this thread, you see what you often see in gun control debates. The gun rights side is rational while the antis are emotional. It’s like arguing with feminists.

(12-16-2012 11:57 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  

assman Wrote:Let’s take a look at the UK, that Sarah Brady paradise of gun control, where gun crime has gone up 89% in a decade. By contrast, lawful gun ownership in the US has been increasing steadily and gun crime has been decreasing. This is even more pronounced if you exclude the parts of the country with the strictest gun control (Chicago, DC, etc.). I posted this along with sources in an earlier thread - I think it was the Zimmerman thread.

That's not a proper argument. By looking at the worldwide stats for firearm-related death rates, I see that USA's rate is 9 (compared to Mexico's 11 and Jamaica's 45), but the UK's is only 0.25.

0.25 * 1.89 = a bit less than 0.5, which is still twenty times less than the USA. Surely you don't believe that such an enormous difference between the two countries can be explained by more gang activity in the USA or whatever.

Ah, the ‘firearms death’ argument. As if dying by knife or bat is better than dying by gunshot.

Let’s look at violent crime in the UK - The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S. The UK, that nationwide ‘gun-free’ zone has a violent crime rate 4X that of the US.

And as I noted earlier, even with the UK’s gun ban, it has seen gun crime nearly double in the last decade - yes, gun crime is still a small absolute number there, but if gun control works, why has the gun crime rate nearly doubled in the last decade??

(12-16-2012 11:57 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  

assman Wrote:F that noise. I carry a gun. If evil comes my way, I am shooting back.

By all means. No one is even talking about taking that away. Just don't carry an AK-47 or a handgun with a 31-bullet ammo magazine or something ridiculous that certainly isn't intended for self-defense.

The Second Amendment is about more than personal self defense.

(12-16-2012 12:00 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  Yessirree!! The more guns the more freedom.

Five more dead in Alabama today, it's not really making the news, bucause, well, that's the price for FREEDOM!! Yay!!!

Yes, there is a cost to freedom. Look at the number of auto fatalities we have in the US, which dwarfs gun homicides. Should we give up cars?

And specifically with respect to guns, a number of us have made the point that government killing of its disarmed citizenry is many orders of magnitude greater than all of America’s psychopath mass killings combined. Yet the statists continue to ignore that, and place their trust in government.

(12-16-2012 12:49 PM)mikeymike Wrote:  outside of pure dictatorships and fucked up regimes how many examples thru history can you provide of nations like the US instituting some sort of gun control and having it be a complete and utter failures?

Chicago.

The global history of gun control is a bloody one indeed.

Some of you act as if the US is forever immune to the tyranny experienced in other countries, and that civilian firearms ownership is irrelevant to that immunity. You take too much for granted. As Thomas Jefferson wrote, “The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is it's natural manure.”

Post: #228

Very sad about this, its a pity this nutcase/filth does not get to face the music.

It WILL happen again unfortunately, nature of the beast.

All i can say is DON'T let them take your guns, its not the answer.

God bless America

"Lifes about, shooting your load"

Post: #229

(12-16-2012 01:30 PM)painter Wrote:  Yeah, we'll never know what the Founding Fathers actually wanted their government to be. Somebody should have told them to write it down or something.

written words have never been interpreted differently by different individuals? Case in point every religious text on the planet...Never undestimate an individuals desire to see what he wants to see in anything.

Post: #230

Just dawned on me:

Where is the shooter's dad?

Doesn't it seem like these cases are coming from single mother homes? Barring that, dads who are never there for the kids?

Before you attack guns, realize that society makes a concerted effort to keep dads away from kids. You can't get up in arms when the real fucking solution is to SOLVE ILLEGITIMACY. We need dads to lay the smack on their mother's inflated empowerment beliefs. And the consequent attitudes that keep fathers from legally disciplining errant behavior.

Post: #231

(12-16-2012 05:59 PM)Grit Wrote:  Just dawned on me:

Where is the shooter's dad?

Doesn't it seem like these cases are coming from single mother homes? Barring that, dads who are never there for the kids?

Before you attack guns, realize that society makes a concerted effort to keep dads away from kids. You can't get up in arms when the real fucking solution is to SOLVE ILLEGITIMACY. We need dads to lay the smack on their mother's inflated empowerment beliefs. And the consequent attitudes that keep fathers from legally disciplining errant behavior.

The shooter wasn't illegitimate. His parents were married and were divorced in 2009. His father had "limited visitation" with him. His father probably didn't have overnight visitation and probably didn't have an extremely close relationship with the shooter for the last few years.

Post: #232

(12-16-2012 05:59 PM)Grit Wrote:  Just dawned on me:

Where is the shooter's dad?

You haven't been paying attention. When not paying 20k monthly alimony to his ex-ex-wife, he was too busy sticking it to this:

Post: #233

(12-15-2012 09:21 PM)Roosh Wrote:  The media has anointed its shooting hero:

http://www.businessinsider.com/how-29-ye...ok-2012-12

This is one I've been seeing on Facebook.


http://www.people.com/people/package/art...03,00.html



Is anyone else annoyed by the media coverage and everyone going on crazy on Facebook?? Something about the whole thing seems weird. I can't explain it...

Post: #234

The media coverage of this is definitely annoying. Like in the faux Morgan Freeman letter, I do believe that it's at least part of the reason stuff like this occurs. The killers names are repeated many times over than the names of all the victims combined. It's almost like they're talking about the main antagonist from an action movie.

Post: #235

(12-16-2012 06:28 PM)houston Wrote:  

(12-15-2012 09:21 PM)Roosh Wrote:  The media has anointed its shooting hero:

http://www.businessinsider.com/how-29-ye...ok-2012-12

This is one I've been seeing on Facebook.

that girl is a hero...she saved kids lives, took bullets for them and lost her life in the process. I've got nothing but respect for what she did.

Post: #236

The apple never falls far from the tree. With a mother like this it's no wonder really:
Gunman's 'survivalist' mother was OBSESSED with guns

Post: #237

"Yes, there is a cost to freedom. Look at the number of auto fatalities we have in the US, which dwarfs gun homicides. Should we give up cars?"

Please guys...stop using this as part of an argument to defend gun ownership. The automobile was built to provide transportation. With the exception of the rare incidents where someone purposely uses an automobile to run someone down, deaths resulting from cars are accidents. And laws have been placed in effect to punish those who operate vehicles while impaired as if they killed someone with a weapon. Guns are made to kill. When someone uses one, it is with the intent to kill. Let's stop comparing guns to cars.

Post: #238

(12-16-2012 08:55 PM)A CLOCKWORK TRADER Wrote:  The apple never falls far from the tree. With a mother like this it's no wonder really:
Gunman's 'survivalist' mother was OBSESSED with guns

From all the reports of the money she was receiving from her ex husband, she was stockpiling cash too.

Post: #239

I found this...

Post: #240

(12-16-2012 09:05 PM)Timoteo Wrote:  "Yes, there is a cost to freedom. Look at the number of auto fatalities we have in the US, which dwarfs gun homicides. Should we give up cars?"

Please guys...stop using this as part of an argument to defend gun ownership. The automobile was built to provide transportation. With the exception of the rare incidents where someone purposely uses an automobile to run someone down, deaths resulting from cars are accidents. And laws have been placed in effect to punish those who operate vehicles while impaired as if they killed someone with a weapon. Guns are made to kill. When someone uses one, it is with the intent to kill. Let's stop comparing guns to cars.

Please stop arguing for gun control by looking at only one side of the equation. Guns are used for defensive purposes far more often than they are used offensively. Antis want to legislate control over the law abiding because of what a tiny minority do.

These defensive uses never get major media attention because it goes against the anti-gun message the major media wants to push.

12-Year-Old Oklahoma Girl Shoots Home Intruder

There was a case earlier this year in NC where a 15yr old boy used his father's rifle to defend himself and his 17yr old sister from 4 home intruders. Guns save lives all the time, but you'll never hear about it from CNN.

Post: #241

(12-16-2012 09:28 PM)assman Wrote:  Antis want to legislate control over the law abiding because of what a tiny minority do.

Isn't it funny how the gun control crowd never seems to understand that criminals won't listen to gun laws either?

Post: #242

(12-16-2012 09:28 PM)assman Wrote:  

(12-16-2012 09:05 PM)Timoteo Wrote:  "Yes, there is a cost to freedom. Look at the number of auto fatalities we have in the US, which dwarfs gun homicides. Should we give up cars?"

Please guys...stop using this as part of an argument to defend gun ownership. The automobile was built to provide transportation. With the exception of the rare incidents where someone purposely uses an automobile to run someone down, deaths resulting from cars are accidents. And laws have been placed in effect to punish those who operate vehicles while impaired as if they killed someone with a weapon. Guns are made to kill. When someone uses one, it is with the intent to kill. Let's stop comparing guns to cars.

Please stop arguing for gun control by looking at only one side of the equation. Guns are used for defensive purposes far more often than they are used offensively. Antis want to legislate control over the law abiding because of what a tiny minority do.

These defensive uses never get major media attention because it goes against the anti-gun message the major media wants to push.

12-Year-Old Oklahoma Girl Shoots Home Intruder

There was a case earlier this year in NC where a 15yr old boy used his father's rifle to defend himself and his 17yr old sister from 4 home intruders. Guns save lives all the time, but you'll never hear about it from CNN.

I don't think too many people argue against home defense. And it seems to me the story WAS reported. It's pretty obvious that a mass shooting will garner more attention than someone killing perpetrators in a home invasion. That's likely to get a lot of local attention, but not national. It isn't a conspiracy, or a liberal attempt to further an anti-gun agenda. That's a reach. Most "negative" stories garner more coverage than "positive" stories - that's the news business.

Post: #243

1n 1996 there was a school massacre in Scotland, 15 kids killed. The UK immediately banned guns. There hasn't been a massacre since.

In 1996 there was a massacre in Australia 35 killed. The government immediately banned guns. There hasn't been a massacre since.

Got to love guns.

Post: #244

(12-16-2012 09:50 PM)garygroundwork Wrote:  1n 1996 there was a school massacre in Scotland, 15 kids killed. The UK immediately banned guns. There hasn't been a massacre since.

In 1996 there was a massacre in Australia 35 killed. The government immediately banned guns. There hasn't been a massacre since.

Got to love guns.

Great.

While we're tossing out examples of other countries, let's consider Switzerland. Nearly every adult male citizen owns a military grade "assault rifle" and the ammunition to go with it. As I understand, in one year there were 27 homicides in the whole of Switzerland, 24 of which were committed by non-Swiss. No massacres.

We can toss examples back and forth all day. What's your point?

Post: #245

yeah there's no point..you're right. Trying to argue logic and common sense with gun lovers is a waste of time. My bad.

Post: #246

(12-16-2012 09:05 PM)Timoteo Wrote:  "Yes, there is a cost to freedom. Look at the number of auto fatalities we have in the US, which dwarfs gun homicides. Should we give up cars?"

Please guys...stop using this as part of an argument to defend gun ownership. The automobile was built to provide transportation. With the exception of the rare incidents where someone purposely uses an automobile to run someone down, deaths resulting from cars are accidents. And laws have been placed in effect to punish those who operate vehicles while impaired as if they killed someone with a weapon. Guns are made to kill. When someone uses one, it is with the intent to kill. Let's stop comparing guns to cars.

And yet, that's very telling isn't it? Weapons that are used to kill are causing much less death than automobiles. So how much of a "problem" is it really?

And the other comment about how the media only reports negative incidences rather than positive ones regarding guns. YOU MEAN THE ANTIGUN LIBERAL MEDIA?

Post: #247

(12-16-2012 10:09 PM)Fisto Wrote:  And the other comment about how the media only reports negative incidences rather than positive ones regarding guns. YOU MEAN THE ANTIGUN LIBERAL MEDIA?

Non-gun owners are usually completely oblivious to how rabidly anti-gun the media is. I know I was when I lived in NYC and didn't own any firearms.

Post: #248

(12-16-2012 10:09 PM)Fisto Wrote:  

(12-16-2012 09:05 PM)Timoteo Wrote:  "Yes, there is a cost to freedom. Look at the number of auto fatalities we have in the US, which dwarfs gun homicides. Should we give up cars?"

Please guys...stop using this as part of an argument to defend gun ownership. The automobile was built to provide transportation. With the exception of the rare incidents where someone purposely uses an automobile to run someone down, deaths resulting from cars are accidents. And laws have been placed in effect to punish those who operate vehicles while impaired as if they killed someone with a weapon. Guns are made to kill. When someone uses one, it is with the intent to kill. Let's stop comparing guns to cars.

And yet, that's very telling isn't it? Weapons that are used to kill are causing much less death than automobiles. So how much of a "problem" is it really?

And the other comment about how the media only reports negative incidences rather than positive ones regarding guns. YOU MEAN THE ANTIGUN LIBERAL MEDIA?

You replaced "stories" with "incidences." That's dishonest. I'm referring to what and how the media reports ANY story, not just stories involving guns.

Post: #249

(12-16-2012 10:04 PM)garygroundwork Wrote:  yeah there's no point..you're right. Trying to argue logic and common sense with gun lovers is a waste of time. My bad.

This is how a lot of anti gun people are. It's a lot like liberals and those ugly feminists who claim to be so open minded. They're closed minded as hell, give off a nasty "holier than thou" attitude and start calling you all sorts of names when you don't agree with them. I'm sure they think I'm some sort of militia, Republican, backwards freak just for having a pistol and not putting all my faith in cops to rescue me if my life's in danger.

Post: #250

Facts About Mass Shootings

Worth reading if you care about the facts. If you just want to emote, carry on.