Post: #26

theyre not terrible, lots of heels, skirts and stockingd

Post: #27

I find the flesh colored stockings thing to be really weird. They wear them when they should be wearing bare feet or a different colored stocking.

Post: #28

i see this outfit all the time: short shorts (sometimes leather), stockings, and high heeled hooker boots. sexy as fuck

Post: #29

So I've been in Beijing for a few days now and I gotta say Xiu Bar at the Hyatt has the best talent I've seen so far in town.
However, most of the top girls sit on tables with the ballers who splash some serious cash for bottles of single-malt scotch and Moet&Chandon champagne. Don't know if they have any game or not, or if it's required at all, since they seem to bring pussy with them rather than having to work to pick up at the club.
I talked to 7-8 girs, and all of them either:
(1) Spoke no English
(2) Gave me an attitude
(3) Just wanted to mooch off a drink from a rich dude
(4) Turned out to be working girls
The latter seemed the most common, but at least they make it clear upfront so you don't waste your time with them. Not that I'm against that but if I want that I'll just go to a brothel and not have to damage my eardrums with loud music at the club and drink $15 cocktails.

San Li Tun bar street is still good for dive bars, some spots there where beers-shots-mixed drinks are 10-15-20 yuan ($2-3) but talent is not so good.
I'm in town until Friday night so PM me if you want to roll together. I operate solo which seems not be the best way to roll here.

Post: #30

China is a bit of its own deal when it comes to having fun and getting laid. There are a few points that I feel are worth making.

*As a foreigner you can totally get laid just on account of being white. Other shades, not so much. However, the women you will get are going to be 5-7's at best by Chinese standards. The good news is that what is a 9 for us is often a 6 by Chinese standards.

Chinese people are incredibly racist and will quickly lower the value of a girl if she doesn't have perfectly white skin. So a girl with a killer body, lovely smile, great personality and fantastic fashion sense (a 9 by our standards) would be only a 5 to Chinese people if she had dark "peasant" skin.

So, if you want a Chinese gf, very easily done. If you want a woman with a high local value, you'd better have some serious game.

*There is no consistency when it comes to visas. As a general rule, however, which has yet to fail me, your first visa, if a tourist visa, will rarely be for more than 30 days. However, if you already have one Chinese visa in your passport (or your expired passport), you will be eligible for a 90 day tourist visa and possible a dual entry tourist visa (90 days per entry, need to go out and come back in again to get the full 180 days).

*Beijing, Shanghai and Hong Kong are the only places where it is ideally comfortable for a Westerner. However, you won't get nearly as much attention just for being a foreigner. This is often a good thing.

*Agreed. Chinese is fricking hard to learn. If you want to learn it, you'd better either be super talented at learning languages just by "picking them up" or you had best enrol in school full time for a short 3-6 month period and do nothing but study Chinese for the duration. This will get you past the hardest part of learning Chinese (starting) and hopefully to a place where you can continue to learn without rote instruction.

Mostly, learning Chinese comes down to your dedication to it. Being willing to spend years in China will help a lot. Learning it well if you plan to spend a year or less in China is going to be a challenge.

If you want to learn Chinese, don't come over as an English teacher. Start as a student and start teaching once you are at an acceptable basic level (500+ vocab). If you have basic abilities, you can improve on those just through daily life.

*There are a lot of girls in China who do speak English, but you gotta know where to meet them. Frequenting "English corners," casual social events organized to practice English (but anyone honest will admit that everyone is there to find a bf. The girls who do, tend to stop coming).

Even if you are teaching for a salary, attending one or more of these regularly scheduled events at a coffee shop or McDonald's somewhere will allow you to avoid screwing up your work situation by dating your students.

My strategy was always to go to these events, form relationships with girls, keep hanging out with them until they lost interest in attending the English corner each week and then get naked with them.

This allowed me to avoid a reputation as a player, which allowed me to stay on the prowl while assembling a reliable soft harem.

*If you really suck, go to a small tier three city/village somewhere. You can be the local foreigner and won't have to face competition from Westerns who actually have a life and speak Chinese.

*The fun starts when you speak Chinese. You can get by without it, but you miss more opportunities that you even realize. Plus, its a huge DHV, especially for the girls who specialize in dating foreigners, because they are used to spending time with lazy asses you don't know how to say anything more than "hello" in Chinese. Chinese folk with no experience with foreigners are notably less impressed if you do speak The Hua. The can't really imagine anyone being stupid enough to not speak Chinese.

*Chinese do not respect foreigners. You'll do best in China if you don't take yourself too serious and learn how to make the best of the situation ($$$). Trying to have a serious career as an English teacher is going to end in suicide or some serious hamsterbation about the "impact" you are having on the students, especially if you work at a private English centre where parents pay big money so that their kids can make fun of their foreigner teacher in a language he doesn't understand.

*If you want to have some serious fun in China, learn how to make fart jokes in Chinese and then teach some classes with 5-15 yr old boys. The laughs never stop.

Post: #31

(03-26-2013 12:43 PM)K-man Wrote:  San Li Tun bar street is still good for dive bars, some spots there where beers-shots-mixed drinks are 10-15-20 yuan ($2-3) but talent is not so good.

Are there still like 4 "Pure Girl" bars in that area?

Post: #32

Suits,
Awesome insight into China and Chinese girls/living in China. I LOVE those posts as it's through these kinds of posts that I get to get a sneak view of how it really is living in China and interacting with Chinese and the girls there on a day to day basis! I totally agree with you that learning Chinese will be extremely important to get the most of things, not only day to day things but also get access to the better girls and also for business/career opportunities there.

One thing really caught my eye in your post:

(03-26-2013 11:06 PM)Suits Wrote:  *There is no consistency when it comes to visas. As a general rule, however, which has yet to fail me, your first visa, if a tourist visa, will rarely be for more than 30 days. However, if you already have one Chinese visa in your passport (or your expired passport), you will be eligible for a 90 day tourist visa and possible a dual entry tourist visa (90 days per entry, need to go out and come back in again to get the full 180 days).

The part in bold/underlined is absolutely awesome! I didn't know about that! Is that only for US citizens or does it apply to Canadians as well or any westerner? I got a 30 day tourist visa when I applied for my trip to China last fall at the Chinese Consulate in Toronto. So when I go back to apply for my next visa in the fall, do I ask them that I'd want a 90 day tourist visa or is that going to be automatically provided by the consulate upon them seeing my previous 30 day tourist visa? Another question on the topic of visas: is there a difference between applying say in Toronto versus in Hong Kong or even in BKK in terms of having a better chance of getting the 90 day and possibly the dual entry 90 day visa?

Speaking of the dual 90 day tourist visa, what are the criterias to be eligible for that visa? That would be exactly what I would want to get upon my return this fall. If you or anyone can shed some more light into this, that'd be brilliant!

Also agreed that the language will be a major challenge to learn. So say I focus the first 4-6 months to enroll full time into a Chinese course in say Guangzhou or Shenzen, would I be able to hold an advanced basic conversation in Chinese and understand about 30-50% of what people would say to me in day to day situations at the end of that 4-6 months full time course?

Thanks a lot man!

Post: #33

Thanks for the info Suits. I only got a 30 day visa as well, hopefully I will get a better one for my future trips like you said.

Post: #34

(03-26-2013 11:44 PM)Vacancier Permanent Wrote:  

(03-26-2013 11:06 PM)Suits Wrote:  *There is no consistency when it comes to visas. As a general rule, however, which has yet to fail me, your first visa, if a tourist visa, will rarely be for more than 30 days. However, if you already have one Chinese visa in your passport (or your expired passport), you will be eligible for a 90 day tourist visa and possible a dual entry tourist visa (90 days per entry, need to go out and come back in again to get the full 180 days).

The part in bold/underlined is absolutely awesome! I didn't know about that! Is that only for US citizens or does it apply to Canadians as well or any westerner? I got a 30 day tourist visa when I applied for my trip to China last fall at the Chinese Consulate in Toronto. So when I go back to apply for my next visa in the fall, do I ask them that I'd want a 90 day tourist visa or is that going to be automatically provided by the consulate upon them seeing my previous 30 day tourist visa? Another question on the topic of visas: is there a difference between applying say in Toronto versus in Hong Kong or even in BKK in terms of having a better chance of getting the 90 day and possibly the dual entry 90 day visa?

Speaking of the dual 90 day tourist visa, what are the criterias to be eligible for that visa? That would be exactly what I would want to get upon my return this fall. If you or anyone can shed some more light into this, that'd be brilliant!

I'm a Canadian citizen, so I can say that it has been true for Canadians, although I can't personally confirm if this would be true or has been true for all countries.

Generally, after you've had one 30 days tourist visa, they may automatically give you a 90 next time around, but I'd make a point of specifying on the application form.

When in Canada, I always mail my passport to a Chinese run (non-embassy) service in Ottawa, which will let me know if I'm going to get rejected before they submit the application. They've saved me some heck before due to some minor technicalities. For example, if you are a student as an occupation, you'll wanna put down the address of your school OUTSIDE China in your application form if you are applying for a tourist visa, because if you put down a Chinese address, they'll reject your visa, assuming that you need to have a student visa instead, which is more complicated to procure.

Quote:Also agreed that the language will be a major challenge to learn. So say I focus the first 4-6 months to enroll full time into a Chinese course in say Guangzhou or Shenzen, would I be able to hold an advanced basic conversation in Chinese and understand about 30-50% of what people would say to me in day to day situations at the end of that 4-6 months full time course?

Thanks a lot man!

If you wanna learn Mandarin, go to Beijing or Tianjin. MOST people in Guangzhou and Shenzhen speak lousy Mandarin, as their first language is Cantonese. Shanghai is also an option, because while Shanghaiese is also spoken, most people have good Mandarin. However, if in Beijing or Tianjin, you will have exposure to both the more neutrally accented Chinese that more educated and/or younger people speak (easier for foreigners to understand and emulated) and the OLD Chinese accent. The further south you go, my less authentic the Mandarin is and you might end up with a sucky accent.

This isn't the worst thing, most places will work, but I'd stay far away from anywhere within 500 km of Hong Kong for sure. Probably 1000 km just to be safe. There are some problem provinces such as Shaanxi where the people have ridiculous accents, but you are unlikely to end up in one of those backwoods places anyway.

Once you've got a decent grasp of Mandarin, (one to two years of northern China experience) it'll be more capable of making the decision as to whether you wanna venture south and learn Cantonese.

You will get a lot of mileage out of Mandarin in the south, but it would be much more difficult to start initially learning it down there.

If you are a fast learner of languages, 6 months will give you the basic ability to get your point across in most situations of incredible simplicity (i.e. buying clothes, asking directions).

If you want to be able to under 30-60% of what people are saying in conversation next to you, you should be prepared to stay for the long haul. I'd say one year can put you in pretty good territory, if you study diligently.

If you suck at languages like me, you'd better get started with a 4-12 month program and then formulate a plan to spend several years in country. Even if you have a good vocabulary set, it will take time to become comfortable with the language.

Even for the talented, the more time in country the better.

My first 3 months with 20-28 hrs of class a week and several hours of vocabulary memorization each night was almost a complete waste. It wasn't until a month into an intensive program my second semester with 30+ hrs of classroom and even more hmwk that things started to click.

But generally, most people can accomplish something to be proud of in a year's time....IF they apply themselves.

Either way, count on an adventure, 'cause you're gonna need to be there for a while.

Post: #35

you learn the best chinese up north in harbin, but cold as fuck. another thing to rememner is that most chinese dont even have a.good grasp of mandarin grammar. they barely study grammar the way we do in the west.

Post: #36

(03-26-2013 11:06 PM)Suits Wrote:  My strategy was always to go to these events, form relationships with girls, keep hanging out with them until they lost interest in attending the English corner each week and then get naked with them.

Who's got time for that, man - I'm just in town for a few days.

(03-26-2013 11:06 PM)Suits Wrote:  If you really suck, go to a small tier three city/village somewhere. You can be the local foreigner and won't have to face competition from Westerns who actually have a life and speak Chinese.

I don't think this will work out very well for the average love tourist. Even in Beijing I can't receive a goddamn fork in a restaurant, or get directions to the Metro in sign language. So in a small city a foreigner would probably not last even a few days before getting incredibly frustrated at not being able to communicate with anyone.

Peace.

Post: #37

Yeah Mandarin is what I want to learn. When I was in Guangzhou, I did go to a couple of universities and enquired about their Chinese (Mandarin) courses for foreigners. From memory, they quoted me a full semester, 20 hours/week in a small class for 8kRMB. Link to one of the U I visited there: http://www.cicgz.com/en/en/about.asp

I also have heard good things about this school in Kunming http://www.keatsschool.com/ At Keats, the small class one semester Chinese course is half the cost of the U in Guangzhou, but GZ is where my contacts are. But gotta say that it's tempting to go to Kunming and not only learn Mandarin but also use that time to do a reconnaissance in the area for biz opps and build a network of contacts. Very tempting indeed!

Shenzen is also a place that's popping up all the time in discussions as a great place to go base myself. I will definitely check it out. I'd much rather be in the south of China as coming from Canada, I'm sick and tired of the long and cold winters here.

I have always enjoyed learning new languages and Mandarin will be my 7th one, 6 of which I speak fluently and one semi fluently. I'm excited about learning Chinese and all the incredible opportunities and doors it will undoubtedly open up for me.

Agreed that China is an incredible adventure and I'm in it for the long haul!

(03-27-2013 12:35 AM)Suits Wrote:  If you wanna learn Mandarin, go to Beijing or Tianjin. MOST people in Guangzhou and Shenzhen speak lousy Mandarin, as their first language is Cantonese. Shanghai is also an option, because while Shanghaiese is also spoken, most people have good Mandarin. However, if in Beijing or Tianjin, you will have exposure to both the more neutrally accented Chinese that more educated and/or younger people speak (easier for foreigners to understand and emulated) and the OLD Chinese accent. The further south you go, my less authentic the Mandarin is and you might end up with a sucky accent.

This isn't the worst thing, most places will work, but I'd stay far away from anywhere within 500 km of Hong Kong for sure. Probably 1000 km just to be safe. There are some problem provinces such as Shaanxi where the people have ridiculous accents, but you are unlikely to end up in one of those backwoods places anyway.

Once you've got a decent grasp of Mandarin, (one to two years of northern China experience) it'll be more capable of making the decision as to whether you wanna venture south and learn Cantonese.

You will get a lot of mileage out of Mandarin in the south, but it would be much more difficult to start initially learning it down there.

If you are a fast learner of languages, 6 months will give you the basic ability to get your point across in most situations of incredible simplicity (i.e. buying clothes, asking directions).

If you want to be able to under 30-60% of what people are saying in conversation next to you, you should be prepared to stay for the long haul. I'd say one year can put you in pretty good territory, if you study diligently.

If you suck at languages like me, you'd better get started with a 4-12 month program and then formulate a plan to spend several years in country. Even if you have a good vocabulary set, it will take time to become comfortable with the language.

Even for the talented, the more time in country the better.

My first 3 months with 20-28 hrs of class a week and several hours of vocabulary memorization each night was almost a complete waste. It wasn't until a month into an intensive program my second semester with 30+ hrs of classroom and even more hmwk that things started to click.

But generally, most people can accomplish something to be proud of in a year's time....IF they apply themselves.

Either way, count on an adventure, 'cause you're gonna need to be there for a while.

Post: #38

(03-27-2013 03:10 PM)Vacancier Permanent Wrote:  Shenzen is also a place that's popping up all the time in discussions as a great place to go base myself. I will definitely check it out. I'd much rather be in the south of China as coming from Canada, I'm sick and tired of the long and cold winters here.

Agreed that China is an incredible adventure and I'm in it for the long haul!

I completely understand your interest in Shenzhen. There is a good likelihood that I will end up living their for a little while (as a stepping stone into Hong Kong or as a base of operations for a longer period of time).

However, if you are serious about learning Mandarin, I'd very much encourage you to at least get a start in Beijing. You can go there for 7 months, from April to October and enjoy pleasant to very warm weather and not have to deal with a Beijing winter. You'll enjoy the benefit of a proper Mandarin environment.

If you try to learn in Shenzhen, you'll learn lots in class, but the you will not benefit nearly as much from using it in daily life.

If you are really interested in Shenzhen and southern China, why don't you consider learning Cantonese first and maybe Mandarin later?

It's easier to go from Cantonese to Mandarin anyway and if you are interested in avoiding the Canadian cold (as I am), you are unlikely to ever live in an area of China where Mandarin will be more useful than Cantonese. Have you given this approach any thought?

Post: #39

Suits, not sure if you mentioned it before, but where in China are you at right now?

Post: #40

(03-27-2013 04:09 PM)FretDancer Wrote:  Suits, not sure if you mentioned it before, but where in China are you at right now?

I'm actually in the Toronto area right now.
Taking a break from Asia to upgrade my qualifications. I will be going back once that is done.

Post: #41

i can think of no reason to learn cantonese over mandarin. especially for business. the street vendors might speak it but anyone govt related will speak mandarin

Post: #42

(03-28-2013 02:22 AM)clever alias Wrote:  i can think of no reason to learn cantonese over mandarin. especially for business. the street vendors might speak it but anyone govt related will speak mandarin

Unless you have your sights set on Hong Kong or Guangdong and there is no scenario where you would go anywhere else in China, I would not say that you should learn Cantonese over Mandarin.

However, if you intend to live in the south prior to getting a good start on Mandarin, it is going to be very difficult to learn Mandarin.

Although many people in Guangdong will speak Mandarin, they suck at it and you will NOT be learning in a immersion environment.

Post: #43

The expats I met in Guangzhou, they all spoke Mandarin and nobody bothered with Cantonese and were doing more than fine. The only reason one would need to learn Cantonese, at least at basic level would be if one were to live in Hong Kong. And even there, everyone speaks English so that can even be avoided. In China, Mandarin is the way to go.

Post: #44

(03-28-2013 12:52 PM)Vacancier Permanent Wrote:  The expats I met in Guangzhou, they all spoke Mandarin and nobody bothered with Cantonese and were doing more than fine. The only reason one would need to learn Cantonese, at least at basic level would be if one were to live in Hong Kong. And even there, everyone speaks English so that can even be avoided. In China, Mandarin is the way to go.

In Hong Kong, not nearly everyone speaks English, but anyone educated does. I find Mandarin pretty helpful in Hong Kong. Between English and Mandarin, I can talk to anyone I need to. This is even more true in Guangzhou. Mandarin is handy anywhere in China, as everyone (now even the younger generations in Hong Kong) studies it.

I just think that trying to learn it in the south would be tough, because it isn't a native speaking environment in my opinion.

Post: #45

not a big deal. i learned it in the south. any university teacher will have a good accent, erhua and all

Post: #46

Thanks for the info, Suits. However, what you say about Mandarin in GZ and SZ is contradictory to the first hand accounts of people I know who live there. It's my understanding that even though it is in the south, both are very new cities, so the majority of residents are immigrants from other parts of China. This means they are native Mandarin speakers, not Cantonese. Also, Mandarin is the language of business in China, so the manufacturers and businessmen in SZ and GZ would also speak Mandarin.

Have you lived in either city, or is it just becuse it's in the south that you assume this would be the case?

Post: #47

(03-29-2013 02:37 AM)RioNomad Wrote:  Thanks for the info, Suits. However, what you say about Mandarin in GZ and SZ is contradictory to the first hand accounts of people I know who live there. It's my understanding that even though it is in the south, both are very new cities, so the majority of residents are immigrants from other parts of China. This means they are native Mandarin speakers, not Cantonese. Also, Mandarin is the language of business in China, so the manufacturers and businessmen in SZ and GZ would also speak Mandarin.

Have you lived in either city, or is it just becuse it's in the south that you assume this would be the case?

even northerners can have their own dialects, as do many easterners.

Post: #48

Got the Beijing flag last night at Xiu Bar.
I know, I know... there are no city flags, but I invented one because I already had the Chinese flag and wanted to feel some sense of accomplishment.
Girl was objectively no more than 5-6 but had some redeeming qualities - a real sweetheart, a large rack (not common in China), and a good fashion style so I was not embarrassed to be seen making out with her at the club. Meet-to-bang time about 1 hour. It went down pretty simply, I opened with "you look like you are having a lot of fun" - thanks Uncle Roosh! She returned the compliment and after about 5 minutes chat I took her hand and led her to the dance floor and immediately proceeded to slow dance to a fast song, then grind, then face-to-face again and got the kiss. After about 30 minutes I flashed the hotel keycard (nice western chain hotel courtesy of my employer) and asked her if she wanted to come enjoy the view and have a drink. Needed some convincing, I also put to use the "don't feel like you have to have sex if you come to my room" - again, thanks Roosh, I've learnt a lot from you and I owe you some drinks if we ever cross ways.
Once inside, I was pleasantly surprised that she did not go straight to the minibar (which is always a rip-off) just chatted and watched TV for 10 minutes, then I showed her where the shower is and put a towel around her neck... flag followed soon thereafter, and she stayed the night for a repeat performance in the morning.
So it is possible to bang Chinese girls just by being an exotic foreigner, I imagine I did not impress her much with any particular verbal game, she was struggling to understand and speak English most of the time. Nor did I spend one yuan on her. The amount of ballers at the club was quite large, and they were spending on bottle service some heavy cash... granted, they got to fuck much hotter girls than I did.

Post: #49

And a final update after I'm out of town now. Got one more bang on my last night in Beijing, and it's a new flag for me too - Portugal.
First I went to the infamous Mix club that I read about here... what can I say - don't wear your expensive shoes there. They will be trampled upon by 3,000 chinese dudes. A lot of girls too, the place has several dance floors, all crowded, so it was easy to grab a girl and grind a bit on her... until the next guy in his turn grabbed her from you.
Could not pull anything out of the dancefloor. And the best girls were (again) sitting on tables with ballers, and I saw something here that I have not seen elsewhere in the world. Perhaps I have not traveled enough. So, usually the ballers get a couple of bottles, Johnie Walker or Absolut if they poseurs or Grey Goose or Single-Malt Scotch if they are rich (or are using a corporate credit card). But here some chinese dudes were getting this on their tables:

I was like, are you guys for real, as if 3 chinese dudes with 3 girls are going to drink 5 liters of 12-yr old Scotch? Never seen such conspicuous consumption. And yeah, I've been to Vegas. I know some people spend even 50k but that's for their whole posse, and at least they know how to drink. Chinese dudes I can't believe are big drinkers, so all this must be just for show-off.

Anyway, after I tried (unsuccessfully) to pull until 3am or so, I headed to the Bar Street in San Li Tun (Mix is also in San Li Tun so it was close) to give it one final shot at the dive bars. And as luck would have it, fate rewarded my Last Man Standing Game with a drunk Portugese chick that I danced with for a little bit and then grabbed by the hand when the lights turned on and put her in a cab. I was prepared with a map and hotel name in Chinese writing to give to the driver (a must in China, good luck without that!) so we took off promptly and I got my flag with a total meet-to-bang time of about one hour. Girl was better than could be expected at such a time/place, probably a 6-7. And again, a real sweetheart.

Post: #50

Great info K-man. Do those clubs have any cover fees? Are drinks expensive once inside?