Post: #1

I wanted to start this thread because there are certain aspects of approach which are definitely different when you reach around 50 YO ( outside of SE Asia and parts of SA. )

I'm hoping for first hand reports and ideas from guys over 45 or at least 40. "My older friend kills it" isn't informative unless you can specifically describe what he's doing.

I don't want to be complaining, just noticing and dealing with what is objective reality in improving and getting results. Please don't preach "it doesn't mean anything" , because as far as I'm concerned, it just means you're either under 45 or a natural. What it means is MORE WORK for results and I know and acknowledge that.

1) One thing I've been dealing with in my mid-fifties here in the States is what I would call approach remorse.

I've gotten in pretty good shape in the last couple months, still about 20 lbs heavier than I was at 35, but i still get initial IOI's from 20-somethings -- from a distance. I have a handsome face and I dye my hair to its original color and keep it long, so I look better/younger from 75 feet away.

A few times the girl has gotten up close as we speak, see the couple of deep wrinkles I have and realized "He's over <whatever her limit is>" and then shy away.

It doesn't happen all the time, but when it does it's pretty noticeable, I've had it happen when she is obviously enchanted, and approached me as I talked to her.
She's all shiny eyed; and then she gets a close look at details of my face and sees some signs of aging and it's an immediate turn-off.

I imagine it's a similar reaction to BO!

I think one thing I can do is approach from a close distance, so the teeny-bopper types that want cute young Jonny screen me out right away.

2) Conversely, losing some lard has helped a lot. If you think about it, overweight is a pretty consistent marker for age. In other words, on average until people get REALLY old and frail fatter people are older.

Over the past 6 weeks I've worked hard with a low carb diet , intense bicycle intervals and long (1-2 hour rides) on my bike and lost 12 pounds of LARD ( from 194 to 182, I'm 5'9") I look MUCH better, and am getting many more IOIs.

Lard is the most obvious, simplest to overcome enemy of the older guy as far as I am concerned.

Post: #2

ha ha.. this is! - the PUA's nightmare:

I'm the oldest guy in the bar!

Post: #3

I usually tell my friends in their mid-40s and up to whiten their teeth and get them fixed if there are problems. That's the pot calling the kettle black since I have the worst teeth of anyone in my circles, but it seems to make a big difference.

Losing weight is a natural requirement. Skip that cardio and do some squats and deadlifts -- it'll help with your posture, and I can not believe how many dudes I know who turned mid-40s and are starting to slouch.

Once you get your BF% down to 12% or so, get your shirts tailored, especially around the waist/sides. I'm almost 40 and I still get IOIs from women half my age who end up being very surprised when I share how old I am -- their most common response is "you're so fit". Yeah, the tailored shirts seem to take 5-10 years off overall.

Post: #4

IKE, have you tried to use some wrinkle cream? Not trying to sound gay, but every bits helps. Look into amino collegens as well. Great for the skin. MikeCF swears by it. I use it as well, and see a difference.

Post: #5

IKE, I've been following your posts and threads since I got here. I don't understand what you're trying to accomplish. You're 50 or so and want to date girls in their early 20s? That are LTR material?

Post: #6

I am 60. The last 20 something I had was quite a while ago -- a Harvard junior. It was her fling with the Daddy substitute.

The fact is, at my age, and yours, 20 somethings are going to be few and far between. And the ones you will get are either complete nut cases or those, like my Harvard junior, who want a substitute taste of the forbidden Daddy fuck.

And I am in great shape -- salt and pepper hair, 34 inch waist, can do 30 pushups and 50 situps, curl 45lbs, bench press 180. I am semi-successful, incredibly charming, confident, and smarter than 98% of the men out there.

If it's hard for me, it's going to be hard for anybody. We forget that while our male brains are wired for the smooth skinned, tight assed, high cheekbones, properly proportioned young females, the young female is wired for the man who is within an age range (looks are less important, obviously, but there are outer boundaries for most women). If I were, say, 35 now, and know what I know, I would be slaying the 20-something babes like Genghis Khan and his hordes through the unarmed villages.

But, alas, there is reality. A 40-year old is much more likely to look past the age difference. The 25 year old? Possible, but low probability.

Post: #7

(09-19-2012 11:03 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  IKE, I've been following your posts and threads since I got here. I don't understand what you're trying to accomplish. You're 50 or so and want to date girls in their early 20s? That are LTR material?

I want to get a good chick and have kids, almost certainly with a non-Murkan. I think the best age would be under 28.

Although I am ultimately bound away from Murka because the young chix seem too hard, I wanted to highlight the coolness of the city I'm in, Davis Ca.

The place is I think tied with MInneapolis as having the best girls I've seen in Murka. I like thin, light makeup, athletic, unassuming plainly dressed good girls who fuck. I am having trouble believing it. It's a 2nd-3rd rate school town now--Davis CA--it's actually a good school, there's a medical school and a vet school here--but snobs and grinds don't seem to come here. Way more relaxed than Berkeley or the Harvard campus.

There just seems to be way more women here than men. Many groups of 2-3 girls in shops. Guys seem to be alone and most sheepish. There is some opportunity now that so many MurkaMen are intimidated. Girls have asked the harassment be stopped and they've gotten what they wanted, and it must suck.

Lots of friendly girls and older grad students, for Murka this may be a poosy paradise. Most I see now are grad students. Obesity is less than 30-40 percent which is way lower than the lower income/education Murka. And right now it is sunny and warm here, mid 80's lots of great places to bicycle.

In EE I have been able to date early 20's (one 20 and unreal) chicks after reaching 50, it's harder than when I was 40 and I was quite surprised these angels would show up, and I was not aggressive enough. Also, these ages now aren't ready to have kids if they have any education aspirations.

In the US I get a lot of initial interest down to maybe 25-27 and then they're turned off when they see the few wrinkles i have.

But sometimes I see chicks like 22 really mooning at me, I'm as surprised as anybody. Usualy ethnic chicks, repressed chicks.

It's considered by other girls to be uncool, so I think girls want stuff they don't talk about to anyone. They don't realize I'm 50+, they're probably thingking 38 with my long blond hair and strutting walk.

I'm in 3rd rate school town now--Davis CA-- and the girls are unbelievable relative to the Murkan average. Most I see now are grad students. Obesity is less than 30-40 percent which is way lower than the lower income/education areas.

I don't think it's a problem with their perception, it's a problem of me not having enough balls and being fast and aggressive enough.

Post: #8

(09-19-2012 11:20 AM)tenderman100 Wrote:  I am 60. The last 20 something I had was quite a while ago -- a Harvard junior. It was her fling with the Daddy substitute.

The fact is, at my age, and yours, 20 somethings are going to be few and far between.
If it's hard for me, it's going to be hard for anybody.

Thanks for the wise reply.

Not to be argumentative, but are you/did you actually keep hitting on them as you aged? I'm guessing from what you say you did, and the success rate just got so low it was depressing.

With me I feel like they're checking me out, but I haven't had the balls to approach a lot so I don't know.

May I ask what kind of approach numbers you were doing?

Post: #9

(09-19-2012 10:55 AM)Aliblahba Wrote:  IKE, have you tried to use some wrinkle cream? Not trying to sound gay, but every bits helps. Look into amino collegens as well. Great for the skin. MikeCF swears by it. I use it as well, and see a difference.

Is this stuff over the counter? thx

Post: #10

(09-19-2012 10:37 AM)ABDada Wrote:  I usually tell my friends in their mid-40s and up to whiten their teeth and get them fixed if there are problems. That's the pot calling the kettle black since I have the worst teeth of anyone in my circles, but it seems to make a big difference.

Losing weight is a natural requirement. Skip that cardio and do some squats and deadlifts -- it'll help with your posture, and I can not believe how many dudes I know who turned mid-40s and are starting to slouch.

Once you get your BF% down to 12% or so, get your shirts tailored, especially around the waist/sides. I'm almost 40 and I still get IOIs from women half my age who end up being very surprised when I share how old I am -- their most common response is "you're so fit". Yeah, the tailored shirts seem to take 5-10 years off overall.

Three great Ideas , I am joining the hotties-saturated gym here in the college town soon, and 12% here I come. I think I'm probably at least 25% now, but I already am getting better reactions now at 185 (5'9") than at 195 (6 weeks ago). I should weigh 155-160.

I clearly need veneers on three front teeth, but they're like 800 each in Murka. I'm thinking of going to Mexico.

Post: #11

(09-19-2012 10:15 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  Thanks for the wise reply.

Not to be argumentative, but are you/did you actually keep hitting on them as you aged? I'm guessing from what you say you did, and the success rate just got so low it was depressing.

With me I feel like they're checking me out, but I haven't had the balls to approach a lot so I don't know.

May I ask what kind of approach numbers you were doing?

After I got divorced, I was doing day approaches at colleges primarily. Not bars. Not a lot. Met two, one of who I did smash. But as I was doing it I could tell -- most were just not interested.

I was also doing on line.

Through Craigslist I met the Harvard junior.

Then I met a married woman. Then another. Now I have three in rotation. They are late 30s, early 40s.

I concentrate exclusively on married women now. I don't bother with the young ones. I just don't see the upside of pursuing young flesh now.

Post: #12

(09-19-2012 09:59 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  

(09-19-2012 11:03 AM)el mechanico Wrote:  IKE, I've been following your posts and threads since I got here. I don't understand what you're trying to accomplish. You're 50 or so and want to date girls in their early 20s? That are LTR material?

I want to get a good chick and have kids, almost certainly with a non-Murkan. I think the best age would be under 28.

Although I am ultimately bound away from Murka because the young chix seem too hard, I wanted to highlight the coolness of the city I'm in, Davis Ca.

The place is I think tied with MInneapolis as having the best girls I've seen in Murka. I like thin, light makeup, athletic, unassuming plainly dressed good girls who fuck. I am having trouble believing it. It's a 2nd-3rd rate school town now--Davis CA--it's actually a good school, there's a medical school and a vet school here--but snobs and grinds don't seem to come here. Way more relaxed than Berkeley or the Harvard campus.

There just seems to be way more women here than men. Many groups of 2-3 girls in shops. Guys seem to be alone and most sheepish. There is some opportunity now that so many MurkaMen are intimidated. Girls have asked the harassment be stopped and they've gotten what they wanted, and it must suck.

Lots of friendly girls and older grad students, for Murka this may be a poosy paradise. Most I see now are grad students. Obesity is less than 30-40 percent which is way lower than the lower income/education Murka. And right now it is sunny and warm here, mid 80's lots of great places to bicycle.

In EE I have been able to date early 20's (one 20 and unreal) chicks after reaching 50, it's harder than when I was 40 and I was quite surprised these angels would show up, and I was not aggressive enough. Also, these ages now aren't ready to have kids if they have any education aspirations.

In the US I get a lot of initial interest down to maybe 25-27 and then they're turned off when they see the few wrinkles i have.

But sometimes I see chicks like 22 really mooning at me, I'm as surprised as anybody. Usualy ethnic chicks, repressed chicks.

It's considered by other girls to be uncool, so I think girls want stuff they don't talk about to anyone. They don't realize I'm 50+, they're probably thingking 38 with my long blond hair and strutting walk.

I'm in 3rd rate school town now--Davis CA-- and the girls are unbelievable relative to the Murkan average. Most I see now are grad students. Obesity is less than 30-40 percent which is way lower than the lower income/education areas.

I don't think it's a problem with their perception, it's a problem of me not having enough balls and being fast and aggressive enough.

Holy crap! Relax and re-group if you can. You're wanting to play a serious game here that requires brass nuts. At your age you may want to loosen your requirements a bit but if not take a push from us like we said before.

Get your Spanish up for the win! If you care!

Post: #13

IKE , Relax my friend and I can totally see where you are coming from, we all are different and we all have our own unique limitations/problems to deal with. One player in another playes shoes can do serious damage but each has to come up with a unique solution for their problems.

You may want to look at changing your pond yet you are where you are for some reason ?

Game on my friend......

Post: #14

(09-19-2012 10:20 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  [quote='ABDada' pid='271300' dateline='1348069074']

I clearly need veneers on three front teeth, but they're like 800 each in Murka. I'm thinking of going to Mexico.

I live on the border. We get what we call Winter Texans who come down here to get away from the cold. Progresso is where they all go for dental and health reasons. I have a denist number who practices in Matamoras, MEX. Highly recommended.

Also you can hit up a resort in PV. I met more than a few Canadians who go get their teeth done and chill for a week. Flight, dental work, and resort is still 1/2 the price of what it cost in Canada.

Research and hit up a border town or resort to get that fixed.

Post: #15

Costa Rica is one of the premier destinations for dental tourism. When in CR last time, I met a guy who had awesome veneers. He was a working stiff, too, and could afford it.

Calling America "murka" all of the time is annoying and try-hard. It's like an old guy wearing an Affliction t-shirt. An older man should talk with with a higher level of sophistication.

Game is about comparative advantage at any age. If you're older, you can't offer the hot body and great face. But you can offer some wisdom, maturity, networking opportunities, life experiences like cooking and travel, etc.

Post: #16

(09-20-2012 10:09 AM)MikeCF Wrote:  Costa Rica is one of the premier destinations for dental tourism. When in CR last time, I met a guy who had awesome veneers. He was a working stiff, too, and could afford it.

Calling America "murka" all of the time is annoying and try-hard. It's like an old guy wearing an Affliction t-shirt. An older man should talk with with a higher level of sophistication.

OK, you're right, I'll call my current location its proper name.

And thanks for the encouragement, I've got the equivalent of like four college degrees, for smart chicks that might count for something.

Post: #17

(09-20-2012 08:41 AM)Lothario Wrote:  IKE , Relax my friend and I can totally see where you are coming from, we all are different and we all have our own unique limitations/problems to deal with. One player in another playes shoes can do serious damage but each has to come up with a unique solution for their problems.

You may want to look at changing your pond yet you are where you are for some reason ?

Game on my friend......

Love Slavic chicks, Latins are second.

I spent 6 mos out of the last year in West Ukraine. Goal not accomplished but got a lot of info and understanding. First time I lived over a month overseas.

I came back for a combination of small items that made it worth it, minor medical and economic reasons, I had storage I had to empty out to reduce expenses (I thought I'd be shipping the stuff over but it turned out to be too expensive), and a possible cushy temp job that looks like it is falling through.

When I next get there I'm going to start in Poland and keep heading East until I get the type of woman I want pregnant or hit Vladivostok.

IDK, maybe then I'll start whaling. I mean real whales.

Post: #18

When I was 30 there was a bar in Rancho Santa Fe California that my friends would go to and pick up older but hotter rich women and they would take them back to their Mc mansion and many legit mansion for play. I went to that bar, and several times accompanied a group of a couple older women and several younger guys to drink fine wine, indulge in pills and powders, or champaign, basically take advantage of the bar and pad and take a look at how the unltra rich lived – horses, Ferraris that kind of shit. I don't think I ever banged one. but I did everything to excess during the 80's and 90's so who really knows…

The point is and all you that read my long ass posts know I go off point, - the point is" We called that bar "the Wrinkle Room!""" jajajajajaja.. well guess fucking what. Now I got wrinkles.. Life is fucking unfair...

Now almost everybody that knows me would not say I am average or 'Normal." So my fellow senior (OUCH!) the key is to play your strengths. I am assuming our strength sets are different, but no matter.

I could go into another kung fu lesson about natural elements of power and acquired elements of power… but most of you here probably don't want to read it and probably wouldn't understand it anyways due to youth or simply uninterested…

But elements of power have do with your macro position. Lets say I have a gun. Big element of power when it comes to a fight. Not really if everybody else has one. And even less if I have a .22 and the other guys have 9mm semi.

So my friend we are out gunned for the most part because youth has a big big advantage with the young.

When I grew up it was "don't trust anybody over 40!" Remember that shit?

I didn't think I would see thirty when I was 21 and I didn't think I would see 40 when I was 31. I sure the fuck never though I would be pushing fucking 60! It almost an impossibility to fathom it, like watching Mick Jagger dance at what 68? Un fucking natural!!!! Deal with the devil kinda shit… Crossroads…

"Game is about comparative advantage at any age. If you're older, you can't offer the hot body and great face. But you can offer some wisdom, maturity, networking opportunities, life experiences like cooking and travel, etc."

You guys may laugh when MikeCF wrote "Cooking" but I can't count how many times we never ate what "we" really "I" started to cook as there was just no time left to eat (priorities you know and who wants to fuck on a full stomach anyways?).

I LOVE cooking dates.

Anyways, MikeCF wrote above was exactly right.

So you are not only outgunned by the young guns but you have no position either.

On the street (in a kung fu sense) you are ready to get your ass kicked (been on both side of the shotgun myself).

And you have got your ass kicked if you want the wrong side of 25 (25 trough 29). I prefer the right side myself but that's yet another long ass post – jajajaja (have to keep myself amused as I aint being paid to write this crap)…

The answer – change you position and fight a battle where you are the only one bringing a gun.

It's not only play your advantage – but set the field up to play to your advantage (that is more balck belt stuff, but that's how I think, so that's how I write).

Change your venue to where women want what you have to offer.

You are talking about recapturing your youth! Futile pursuit.

If you can fucking do that than Ponce De Leon got nothing on you.. and by the way "Bottle it" cause I sure the fuck want some! Jajajaja

You got wrinkles – be proud of them. You got grey fucking hair – die it or don’t, you got a paunch, lose it or don't. Tailored shirts? Yeah I can see it, but you might not need em.

Point: You think Phillip Seymour Hoffman get laid? Shit just his name would put him through a prolonged dry spell - and those looks? Betcha he's fucking knee deep in pussy to the point where he could go gay!

The question is, before you start doing all this cosmetic shit, what do you have to offer. If you got a big engine (other thread I started about money – read it if you can't sleep) you can use it to barrel over chicks with interesting crap. Now many young people through no fault of their own (and cuz they are buried in a day job) live uninteresting lives. They really got nothing to say…

How many times have I read on a chicks profile "I want to meet interesting people." Now you can be educated but that does not mean you are interesting.

One definition of interesting is "risk taker."

Can you live out of your comfort zone? If so do it, cause you will have some stories to tell.

Now if you are just another run of the mill got nothing to say dick, you will have to compete with the same types, which is ok… most people are like that and if you are 25 and have some kind of angle you are still gonna bang 20 something year olds.

But 50? (I am in my 50s BTW). Shit you better bring something special to the party or don't par-teh here (if you know what I mean).

That special thing is interesting stories and giving the inexperienced the benefit of your knowledge (all possible puns intended if you know what I mean).

Can you speak in profundity about the art of riding a Harley through the fog with 3 feet of visibility at 75 MPH high on LSD? That's interesting shit right there. Or having a mountain lion back track you and your chick as you guys were leaving a dry river bed in Northern Argentina behind your buddies winery? I could go on…

Showing them your college degrees aint interesting. This has to do with the other thread regarding building your engine, that is creating who you are (go ahead and read that boring shit ("does money make a difference in game" I think is the title).

So you create an interesting personality (by taking chances/risking) and juice it with some money, move out of fucking Murica – or what ever that lame name you called the US was (jajaja – don't take me personally – just amusing myself at your expense – hahahaha), and you are knee deep in rug rats getting your dick sucked at will by your 27 year old wife and your 23 year old girlfriend (though usually not simultaneously / but maybe depending on exactly what kind of engine you got and the type of fuel you are using!!!).

Change you venue, change your name, change your life - tell some good stories, realize you are gonna die anyways so lose the fear about risking and approaching, and get over fucking rejection (which really is not rejection: as "No" only means "No, not right now.").

Do that and you will get what you want (shit you will also have to learn some Spanish (small price to pay for that velvet soft skin, perky tits, and love to watch you walk ass shake… and and did Imention that young dumb and full of cum attitude that goes with many youngins… Look sometimes in the morning I just lift up at the sheet and look at that young beautiful tightass chick laying there and everything is just right in the world. EVERYTHING! Shit I will even get up and fix her breakfast if she is a newbie or at least have the maid do it if its during the week….I love my maid… but not that way you pervs…

Hey Jed you could find you own Latina Elli May (You will get that – the young ones reading this thread won't) hey but they have youth so I am jealous of them so fuck em… jajajaj just kidding you guys (about the fuck em part) yes all us older guys are jealous of your youth, you just wait and you will know all about what I mean… then you will really wonder "how did that fucking Coyote mange to keep banging 22 year olds???" It takes a sharp sword to slay the opposition at our ages… just wait you will see…

Only the good die young…

Bottom line is you cannot play a young man's game if you are not a young man. You have to develop your unique "mature" (hahahah love that word (not really) game... also don't talk like I do on the forum - guy-talk seldom works with the young lovely's - they like respectful shit! Unless of course they are tramps...

(There goes another hour)

Post: #19

Some notes I've noticed as far as looking better besides losing lard which is going great on low carb diet :

If you dye your hair to hide grey, there's ways to do it that are less conspicuous.

What looks fake is when your hair is all one color all over your head exactly the same

I'm surprised I even see Hollywood stars doing this. Natural hair always varies.

So what you can do is:

1) Use a color very close to your natural color. There are two color axes, one is dark/light, the other is how much green is in the dye ( Dyes with green are called "Ash" colors and prevent that brassy fake blond look)

2) Apply it to the grey first. wait 20 minutes or so

3) Then apply irregularly to rest of hair. Do some in 5 minutes, some another 5 minutes later. then a few minutes before you rinse it, mush it all through so all of it gets some color.

Then it doesn't look uniform and artificial. People are usually quite surprised when I say I dye my hair because it looks natural and I've kept my skin up with sunscreen.

Post: #20

Yeah, age can suck. But nothing beats the high you get from taking down a dude half your age in a martial arts tournament.

Post: #21

Or showing them up badly with a deep, heartfelt instrumental solo they cannot match for at least 20 years....

I was at a party playing my original songs from a lifetime of disappointment, and my ripped, very good looking, but rather dim-witted competitor was talking about how to make high-alcohol cocktails.

The twenty something chicks were telling him to be quiet so they could listen to me.

Post: #22

Your age and looks shouldn't have been a dealbreaker in Ukraine. You were doing something wrong.

Here's something to lift your spirits:

Flavio's big, old belly game

More of Flavio's belly game

Flavio, his wife, and their son on the beach

Flavio files