Post: #1

Quote:Diabetes patients of normal weight are twice as likely to die as those who are overweight or obese. That finding makes diabetes the latest example of a medical phenomenon that mystifies scientists. They call it the obesity paradox.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/18/health...eight.html

But here's the kicker which you have to read carefully in order to find: any protective mechanism with fat is after you've already developed the illness, which you are more likely to develop if you are fat (type 2 diabetes).

It's all over the article...

Quote:One study found that heavier dialysis patients had a lower chance of dying than those whose were of normal weight or underweight. Overweight patients with coronary disease fared better than those who were thinner in another study; mild to severe obesity posed no additional mortality risks.

In other words: if you have a disease and are already sick then don't be too thin. Yet outlets like Jezebel are already stuffing their face after reading the article...

Quote:A person who exercises and weighs more is often healthier than a person who doesn't and weighs less.

"I'm healthy at 200 pounds because I can walk a marathon in six hours!"



http://jezebel.com/5944171/science-prove...an-obesity

The NY Times and Jezebel---tag teaming yet again to increase the weight of a once great nation. Aren't people already fat enough for them?

Post: #2

Yes, unfortunately the NYT has dumbed itself down so much it's hardly worth reading anymore. Like you imply the vast majority of people with diabetes have "adult onset" diabetes as a result of being overweight or obese. Overweight diabetics like to point to healthy weight people with diabetes, like Halle Berry, to "prove" it has nothing to do with weight, but in Miss Berry's case it's genetically caused. In their case it's because of all the damage they're doing to themselves by being on a non-stop starch fueled blood sugar roller coaster.

Not all hope is lost. In a far corner of the world (South Africa) a VERY prominent doctor and sports scientist has recently come out against the low fat high-carb world view, and how it negatively affects heart disease, obesity and diabetes. He's going to be, actually is being, crucified by the majority of doctors, but at least some people in the medical field think for themselves. Here's a link for anyone interested:

http://www.health24.com/medical/Conditio...,76701.asp

Post: #3

This is kind of a non-sequiter reference but I always thought the portrayal of humans in the future in WALL-E was pretty ballsy. When I saw it I was like, "Shit, we're almost there."

Post: #4

I'm going with the hypothesis that if you're skinny and have a lifestyle disease, it's genetic. Which means it's not as likely caused by your lifestyle choices, and the disease should NOT get significantly better with exercise/diet. If you're fat and have a lifestyle disease, it's due to your lifestyle choices, meaning quit eating so fucking much and the disease should get better.

Shit like this makes me glad I'm in Europe even though it's retarded in its own way too.

Btw, I find it scary that the people who are supposed to communicate information to the masses are some of the dumbest mother fuckers in the world. They regularly mess up the facts and analysis like this all the time.

Post: #5

These girls aren't very bright, are they?
Some of the idiots are now leaning on some Canadian study that supposedly says that out of 11,000 people, those who were obese had lower mortality than those of normal weight.

This says nothing about morbidity, or those who contract serious diseases because of their weight and end up having it managed for the rest of their lives by the healthcare system. That lower mortality risk could very easily be a testament to the Canadian healthcare system, not to any notion that obesity is inherently safer. The higher morbidity would also support the notion that obesity is much more expensive (higher acquisition rate of diseases, more time spent dealing with them albeit doing so successfully in many cases). Jezebel and the rest of the fatty-defense brigade won't dive into that one.

I was pleased to see that quite a few of the comments pointed this out quite clearly:

"proletarian_tenenb… an hour ago
This headline is embarrassingly misleading. The data shows that, IF YOU HAVE A DISEASE ALREADY, then more weight can lead to better outcomes. It says nothing about disease prevalence in thin people versus overweight people.

Honestly, the science writing on here is some of the worst I've seen on the internet. I would likely have to venture on to a creationist website to find writers less capable of interpreting basic research."

Zuleikha Reply
"Yeah, Jez science writing is terrible. I don't know why Jezebel doesn't hire someone who can actually handle reading research papers to write up science. I had to defend an ev psych research paper on Jezebel because the article about it was so horrible. I'm a cultural anthropologist by training. You know science writing is bad when it leads a cultural anthropologist to defend an ev psych study!"

MoonDusted Reply
"Yep. Tracie Egan Morrissey doesn't even seem to understand that you can't even come close to "proving" her statement without determining causality. Most science reporting is bad, but this is truly, truly terrible,"

Professor Pink Reply
"I have to agree--there are things Jez does well. Science writing is SO not one of them.

justme35 Reply
"But how can they prove they are better for being fat and that thin people should all be ashamed of themselves if they actually read the studies?

Ever since the redesign of the comments these main pages have become an all-out anti-skinny women rant."

Femzoil2 and 1 more Reply
"Haven't you heard? "Science reporting" on Jezebel runs two ways:

If a study supports what we want to believe: it's strong, definitive evidence that is unassailable. It's hard proof!

If a study doesn't support what we want to believe: the sample size is wrong, the methodology is questionable, and the researchers are biased. It's junk science!"

Some went as far as to say that jezebel is a "shitstain on the progress of women in science".

CoronaExtra and 2 more Reply
"Jezebel has really become a shitstain on the progress of women in science."

And this commenter didn't get shot down immediately! People actually agreed!

colorisnteverythin… Reply
^"I know. There are SO MANY of us on here that say this every time and are clearly educated enough to comment on these issues. Not everyone writes scientific papers or publishes in/ reads peer-reviewed work all day. Can they not find someone who does?"

Professor Pink Reply
^"Harsh, but true."

I was surprised to see such comments get so much support. If even many of the jezebelites aren't buying this kind of crap, then there is hope for the rest of society.

Post: #6

This is one of the most bizarre articles ever, but it can be applied to all sorts of things:

If you have a fucked up heart, of course doing HIIT is going to be bad for you.
If you've ripped a muscle, of course lifting weights with it is going to be bad for you.
If you've got a delusional worldview, of course reading about science is going to be bad for you.

Post: #7

Quote:“If we’re open-minded when we look at the data, we often find confounding factors that can explain the disease associations we blame on weight,” said Linda Bacon, a nutrition professor at City College of San Francisco and author of “Health at Every Size: The Surprising Truth About Your Weight.”

Bacon.
Bacon.
Bacon.
BACON.

Post: #8

Roosh, I know you studied science in college, and worked in a lab of some sort. Given that you're only here briefly, I'm going to recommend you for the Jezebel Scientific Scholar in Residence Fellowship.

I just saw some graphs the other day of how obesity actually becomes less common after a certain age, because people just start shedding weight. For the elderly, the thinnest people are often the sickliest, so it's not as surprising as you might expect that the thin diabetics are worse off. I know this sounds circular, but I always hear old people saying their doctors are concerned about their weight loss, that weight loss is usually a bad thing as an old person, as it usually means they are wasting away, not merely losing fat.