Post: #1

Quote:

Of course, yes. You can find people who smoked a pack of cigarettes a day and lived to be 100, too. Any one example doesn't make the case.

It is pretty clear that people back in the 1950s, eating all this red meat, were not living very long compared to how long we're living today. Red meat consumption has gone down; poultry has gone up. There has been a general shift in a better direction in our diets.

Red meat is not the whole picture, but the reduction probably has been a contributor to the reduction in mortality rates that we have today.

Full Article: http://www.latimes.com/health/la-he-five...5134.story

Post: #2

Good thing I tend to prefer poultry anyway. I usually only mess with red meat at school, where my options are limited.

Leans proteins are key to aesthetics, and fish/poultry provide them in greater bulk than most red meats. The occasional steak is nice, but always in moderation.

Post: #3

I tend to eat most meats in moderation as I come from a family full of folks dead from heart disease. As most of them died before I came of age, I'm unsure as to whether or not there's a gene for having a shitty cardiovascular system, or if most of them simply had a shit diet. Maybe a combination of both.

Pulled pork is my weakness, though. Gotta indulge every now and again.

Post: #4

Red meat from cows fed with grains, pumped full of toxic chemicals and living in unsanitary conditions might be unhealthy but organic grass fed cattle is a different story.

Post: #5

A good steak, from grass fed cows , once in a while (once a month) is part of a healthy diet in my humble opinion! Especially if you're active sportswise.

And cooked just right is ABSOLUTELY MOUTH WATERINGLY DELICIOUS!I had just that last night..under the grill for just under 10 minutes..with garlic potatoes and beans and leeks....mmmm...that warm blood was oozing out of that flesh...mmmm

As the French say: C'etait une orgasme de la bouche!

Red meat every day or two is a bad choice though..no matter how organic it is!

Post: #6

Source: Okay, I get an error alert about not being able to post links yet, so Google search the bold title and it'll pop up.

There's a million studies confirming either side of this debate, so it's a good idea to read about research methodology. How do we know what a good diet is, and what's a good study design to test our hypotheses when we are talking nutrition?

Science, Pseudoscience, Nutritional Epidemiology, and Meat

This article by Gaury Taubes is solid. He wrote Good Calories, Bad Calories and critiques a lot of the 'science' behind dietary advice. Given the fact that we grow fatter and fatter, that's not that far fetched. From the article:

"Back in 2007 when I first published Good Calories, Bad Calories I also wrote a cover story in the New York Times Magazine on the problems with observational epidemiology. The article was called “Do We Really Know What Makes Us Healthy?” and I made the argument that even the better epidemiologists in the world consider this stuff closer to a pseudoscience than a real science. I used as a case study the researchers from the Harvard School of Public Health, led by Walter Willett, who runs the Nurses’ Health Study. In doing so, I wanted to point out one of the main reasons why nutritionists and public health authorities have gone off the rails in their advice about what constitutes a healthy diet. The article itself pointed out that every time in the past that these researchers had claimed that an association observed in their observational trials was a causal relationship, and that causal relationship had then been tested in experiment, the experiment had failed to confirm the causal interpretation — i.e., the folks from Harvard got it wrong. Not most times, but every time. No exception. Their batting average circa 2007, at least, was .000."

We can debate and disagree until the end of times about what exactly constitutes ultimate alphaness, but we can all agree that a critical mind is part of it.

Read the article and eat your beef.

Post: #7

I could note, as others have, that the "red meat" we're eating today isn't the red meat of yesterday.

How many burgers have we eaten that, unbeknownst to us, was actually pink slime:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boneless_le..._trimmings

Is eating grass-fed beef going to kill me?

I will continue eating steak.

Eating steak may rob me of my, what, 70's?

That's a risk I'm willing to take.

Having watched friends and family go from 70 to 80: I haven't seen anything that makes me say, "I wanna get really old!"

Instead, I've seen smart successful people become absent-minded, bitter, and angry. I've seen active people barely able to walk.

Also, staying single instead of settling down is also bad for your health.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44122528/ns/...29guaI9mrk

Post: #8

MikeCF Wrote:Also, staying single instead of settling down is also bad for your health.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44122528/ns/...29guaI9mrk

Correlation does not necessarily equal causation.

Also, they excluded divorced and widowed people from their study.

Post: #9

(03-25-2012 03:57 PM)blurb Wrote:  

MikeCF Wrote:Also, staying single instead of settling down is also bad for your health.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44122528/ns/...29guaI9mrk

Correlation does not necessarily equal causation.

Also, they excluded divorced and widowed people from their study.

That's just a throw-away line.

Correlation is evidence of causation.

Correlation studies are the basis for almost everything modern science knows.

Being single is correlated with all sorts of dangerous and risky activities.

Married men are less likely to own a motorcycles, have multiple sexual partners, and see a doctor. (Most men go to the doctor only after being nagged by the wife.)

Being a lifelong player is a dangerous activity - perhaps riskier than eating red meat.

Doesn't mean guys shouldn't do it.

Life is risk.

I'll keep eating steak.

Post: #10

They're entirely ignoring advances in modern medicine, choosing to pin longer life expectancy on diet.

What about lower infant mortality? What about better life support systems for the very old? These could be massive contributing factors to longer life expectancies.

But instead they say it's because we stopped eating the food that we evolved to eat as hunter gatherers. Typical "professional" science.

Post: #11

Quote:Red meat is not the whole picture, but the reduction probably has been a contributor to the reduction in mortality rates that we have today.

Probably! Is that the standard we make now on telling the public what they should eat?

Post: #12

"I stopped eating meat and I never felt better."

I have heard this god knows how many times in America. It's like a meme.

Well I did stop eating meat two times. Once I was a teenager, about 16 or so. And then another time in my late 20s. I didn't feel better, in fact I felt worse, especially the first time. I didn't have any more energy than before.

I can't speak for women, but guys who eat meat (responsibly) are more likely to look healthier and stronger. The vegan guys who probably also jog a lot look sickly to me. I just don't buy that it's bad for you.

Post: #13

A humans diet should be mostly veg but if you keep your meat intake at around 25% you will be fine. I think now the average American diet is 60-70% meat which is way to much, the body can only process so much and much of the just gets stored away like garbage in a landfill in your body.

Red meats imo are sensitive to your genes. Heart issues plague a lot of us black folk because are bodies do not break down red meat well at all. We traditionally never ate the stuff favoring more lean meats like goat.

Post: #14

(03-25-2012 08:19 PM)kosko Wrote:  A humans diet should be mostly veg but if you keep your meat intake at around 25% you will be fine. I think now the average American diet is 60-70% meat which is way to much, the body can only process so much and much of the just gets stored away like garbage in a landfill in your body.

Red meats imo are sensitive to your genes. Heart issues plague a lot of us black folk because are bodies do not break down red meat well at all. We traditionally never ate the stuff favoring more lean meats like goat.

I think the major problem with black folks is that we've traditionally eaten the worst/fattiest cuts of meat. We traditionally cook other foods in animal fats. A combination of cutting down on red meats, eating better cuts when we do, and cooking in a more healthy manner will go a long way towards being healthier. Personally, I could live without red meat. I can't live without eating FLESH. I could be just fine with chicken and seafood exclusively. I love it that much. But I still love a good burger every so often. Lean cuts of pork are every bit as healthy as good cuts of beef. Pork gets a bad rap.

I'm with Roosh though. I've always found vegetarian/vegan types to be weak looking. I've also heard plenty of chubby/fat chicks claim to be vegetarians. People fool themselves, thinking they're healthier, but there are plenty of things that are technically vegetarian that can fatten you up.

Post: #15

Many vegetarians are more unhealthy than meat eaters. They stuff them selves with carbs and end up bloating up just as quick if not more. Ya Pork does get hated on ... but they are a grizzly bunch of animals. As much as I like a good tenderloin... They do eat their own shit lol.

Post: #16

Go for bison, horse, deer and moose meat.
it's the best.

the beef meat of today aint the same as yesterday....

Post: #17

(03-26-2012 08:57 PM)metalhaze Wrote:  Go for bison, horse, deer and moose meat.
it's the best.

the beef meat of today aint the same as yesterday....

Can't say that I tasted the beef of yesterday, but I will definitely vouch for the other animals. Delicious taste, and generally healthier than a lot of livestock - wild game tends to lead an active life, less fat, and quite tasty. Not to mention that wild game isn't pumped full of hormones and antibiotics.

Another wild favorite = rabbit.

Post: #18

(03-26-2012 05:52 PM)kosko Wrote:  Many vegetarians are more unhealthy than meat eaters. They stuff them selves with carbs and end up bloating up just as quick if not more. Ya Pork does get hated on ... but they are a grizzly bunch of animals. As much as I like a good tenderloin... They do eat their own shit lol.

HA HA! That's actually not true either. The pork from the pigs we eat now aren't rooting around in slop and feces. Now when I was a kid and spent time down in the woods of North Carolina, that was a different story! I had cousins that had some animals out back - chickens and pigs. The pigs were kept in a pen that was pretty nasty. They ate out of a old car hood. We were told never to throw anything away - it went into a slop bucket, which got dumped into the pen for the pigs to eat. The animals on the farms that produce the meat we eat don't live that way.

Post: #19

(03-26-2012 08:57 PM)metalhaze Wrote:  Go for bison, horse, deer and moose meat.
it's the best.

the beef meat of today aint the same as yesterday....

In upstate NY, they have farms that raise Beefalos, a hybrid of cows and buffalo. Depending on where you live, those other animals are eaten. I don't believe horses can be legally slaughtered in the US - am I wrong?

Post: #20

(03-26-2012 09:54 PM)Timoteo Wrote:  I don't believe horses can be legally slaughtered in the US - am I wrong?

Horse slaughter quietly signed back into law after 5 yr. ban.

I'm keen to try it at some point. Quite tough from what I've heard unless cooked well.

Post: #21

(03-26-2012 10:13 PM)MSW2007 Wrote:  

(03-26-2012 09:54 PM)Timoteo Wrote:  I don't believe horses can be legally slaughtered in the US - am I wrong?

Horse slaughter quietly signed back into law after 5 yr. ban.

I'm keen to try it at some point. Quite tough from what I've heard unless cooked well.

Very interesting. Thanks. I know that thoroughbreds that weren't winning were shipped to Mexico to be auctioned off and slaughtered ("Real Sports" did a piece last year on this. There was actual footage of the auctions and the slaughter - sometimes they'd stab the horse in the neck to sever the spinal cord, others were just shot) for meat. The problem with thoroughbreds is that they're bred for speed, and are very muscular, so I'd imagine the meat would be very tough. You'd probably need to tenderize/marinate the hell out of it for a couple of days before attempting to cook it.

Post: #22

(03-25-2012 08:19 PM)kosko Wrote:  A humans diet should be mostly veg but if you keep your meat intake at around 25% you will be fine. I think now the average American diet is 60-70% meat which is way to much, the body can only process so much and much of the just gets stored away like garbage in a landfill in your body.

Red meats imo are sensitive to your genes. Heart issues plague a lot of us black folk because are bodies do not break down red meat well at all. We traditionally never ate the stuff favoring more lean meats like goat.

• If you eat junk and you don't exercise you will get fat.
• If you eat junk and you do exercise you will build muscle and probably be fat.
• If you eat clean with lots of meat from organic sources you won't get fat. Whether you exercise or not.
• If you eat a diet of mostly vegetables, you will become malnourished.

Post: #23

(03-26-2012 11:58 PM)Timoteo Wrote:  The problem with thoroughbreds is that they're bred for speed, and are very muscular, so I'd imagine the meat would be very tough. You'd probably need to tenderize/marinate the hell out of it for a couple of days before attempting to cook it.

Undoubtedly. One of my favorite novels is All Quiet on the Western Front, it contains a passage about horse meat:

Quote:Kat knows the way to roast horse-flesh so that it's tender. It shouldn't be put straight into the pan, that makes it tough. It should be boiled first in a little water.

Now, where to actually purchase horse meat?

Post: #24

Baby dies after being exclusively breastfed from a vegan mother. Apparently, vegan's are supposed supplement their diet with additional vitamins to prevent deficiencies. Or they could, you know, just eat some meat.

http://www.thehealthyhomeeconomist.com/b...ther-dies/

Post: #25

I agree with the article. Eating what we've been evolutionarily specialised for over the course of millions of years is clearly a bad idea.

Oh wait, no it isn't.