Post: #226

No doubt my education level and income is skewing my results. But that hasn't changed since my previous visit to Kiev. I am just relaying my perception that the whole war thing is causing a resurgence in women wanting to leave - and the promise of that is a strong part of my pitch. My 90% conversion of digits to dates is holding strong, but the conversion to bangs is still low since they are still vetting me to see if I am just a sex tourist.

FYI - Kiev on a Tuesday night.

Buddha bar - completely dead.
Arena - completely dead.
Vodka Bar - 6-8 young hotties, pretty drunk and friendly. Saw one guy (20s, 4-5) take a girl (early 20s, 6-7, pretty face) into one of the bathroom stalls, not sure if he just got a BJ or a quick fuck. Her friends walked into the unisex bathroom while I was there and I joked about it - they did not seemed surprised. After they came out, the girl started heavy make out session with another girl, and the lucky guy was groping another girl. Interesting entertainment for a Tuesday.

I didn't go anywhere else since my date that evening lasted past 11. I am waiting at my apt - yesterday's date is coming over with pizza. Wish me luck.

Post: #227

(11-05-2014 01:57 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  Yes the girls must be all wanting to leave now. Akula confirmed it. It is like 1996-1998 all over again. Those years were legend. Sorry we all missed it.

We have an encore now again, or I can sell you the Bklyn bridge.

However, I wouldn't be surprised that the girls have less chances to be wined and dined these days. You guys as foreigners with hard currency make the perfect escort . And a few more might be skilled at 'you scratch my back and I will scratch your back'.

If history is repeating itself I suspect the majority of visa/passport chasers are mothers with children. The majority of dinner whores is the same garden variety as usual.

If Ukraine's economy implodes next year (strong possibility considering they will probably default on their debt), then you could see a resurgence in Ukraine of the golden years of the late 90's once again.

Post: #228

(11-03-2014 07:24 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  Got a huge one bedroom apt for $55 a night on airbnb. The asking price was $70/night I think but there are many properties available so many of the places were willing to deal.

(11-03-2014 07:24 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  I am one of those hated 1%'ers

(11-03-2014 07:24 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  the McDonalds in the middle of Kreshchatyk St has a 24 hour window and I softened the blow of a busted night as I softened my belly.

1%'er negotiating on Airbnb & dining at McDonalds.

I'm not hating on living frugal. Just trying to understand your status, and your wealthy westerner game style over there.

Respect that you went.

Post: #229

(11-05-2014 03:19 PM)The Texas Prophet Wrote:  

(11-05-2014 01:57 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  Yes the girls must be all wanting to leave now. Akula confirmed it. It is like 1996-1998 all over again. Those years were legend. Sorry we all missed it.

We have an encore now again, or I can sell you the Bklyn bridge.

However, I wouldn't be surprised that the girls have less chances to be wined and dined these days. You guys as foreigners with hard currency make the perfect escort . And a few more might be skilled at 'you scratch my back and I will scratch your back'.

If history is repeating itself I suspect the majority of visa/passport chasers are mothers with children. The majority of dinner whores is the same garden variety as usual.

If Ukraine's economy implodes next year (strong possibility considering they will probably default on their debt), then you could see a resurgence in Ukraine of the golden years of the late 90's once again.

Does that mean I will end up with another wife? hm..2 is better. J/K

Post: #230

(11-05-2014 07:10 PM)Courage Reborn Wrote:  

(11-03-2014 07:24 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  Got a huge one bedroom apt for $55 a night on airbnb. The asking price was $70/night I think but there are many properties available so many of the places were willing to deal.

(11-03-2014 07:24 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  I am one of those hated 1%'ers

(11-03-2014 07:24 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  the McDonalds in the middle of Kreshchatyk St has a 24 hour window and I softened the blow of a busted night as I softened my belly.

1%'er negotiating on Airbnb & dining at McDonalds.

I'm not hating on living frugal. Just trying to understand your status, and your wealthy westerner game style over there.

Respect that you went.

Is that 1% in Ukraine or 1% in USA. Big difference..most of us are top 1% in UA. But I am more figuring why top 1% in USA would even go to a place like UA and need to chase them. Last I checked girls chase the 1% in the west...and less chance of tapeworms lol.

Post: #231

Ok - to answer your questions. 1% US. Maybe closer to 0.1% but I don't really give a shit since I don't live that lifestyle. I am not Bill Gates. I have enough that I don't have to worry.

Why airbnb? Because I grew up dirt poor in a small town in ohio and sometimes it is hard to change one's ways. I might go to vegas and drop $10K on a table at a club, but a part of me is still frugal and remembers getting the free lunches in school because my family was so poor.

Why McD's? Because they are open 24 hours and I was hungry.

Kiev - Day 3.

I partied hard at Vodka bar till 5 am, got breakfast, and wrote a long ass expose' on my day, up until my laptop froze and I lost everything. Sorry, too tired and hung over to type it over.

Had date at apt. She brought the pizza, good times, I up'd the kino, and she gives me the fuckin' "I am a good girl" line. God bless you guys who fight thru the LMR, I don't have patience for that shit. I tell her she needs to go home. After I leave, I go thru my standard replies (I am looking for gf, we have no passion, etc.) 50% of the time, if I go on another date with the girl, she gives up the vagina. The other 50% I really don't give a shit about since I have a 22 yo law student waiting for my pleasure pole when I get back to the states.

TIP #1 - your game is always strongest when you are getting a steady source of pussy. The extra confidence (and lack of desperation) really makes it a lot easier to keep new pussy in the pipeline.

Ok - its 1230. I decide to pass on Caribbean club. Weds can be a good night there, a fair number of girls looking to hookup with a foreigner, but I pass. Been there, done that.

Arena - still seems sort of dead.

So I bounce to shooters. Its 1 am. Pretty packed, 50:50 ratio. A third of the girls are young and tight, definitely fuckable. One third are pro or semi pro. One thirds are older chicks that I would not fuck if my prostate depended on it.

My review: any girl that goes to Shooters on a Weds night is DTF. Girls making out with guys left and right. 80% of the guys are no competition whatsoever. Old or desperate looking. I run into a girl I met off of millionaire match.com. She starts to flirt with me, but I already knew she was a semi-pro, and she leaves with some douche. Had lots of fun though. 50% of the girls didn't speak english well enough to have a conversation, but were down to get the grind on.

Ok. It is a seedy environment but there are still targets in site. Everyone knows why they are there and its a cheap hookup. I think it is a viable alternative for a wednesday night. I was planning on going to Forsage later that night, but ended up leaving Shooters at 5 am.

Post: #232

(11-05-2014 10:05 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  Ok - to answer your questions. 1% US. Maybe closer to 0.1% but I don't really give a shit since I don't live that lifestyle. I am not Bill Gates. I have enough that I don't have to worry.

Why airbnb? Because I grew up dirt poor in a small town in ohio and sometimes it is hard to change one's ways. I might go to vegas and drop $10K on a table at a club, but a part of me is still frugal and remembers getting the free lunches in school because my family was so poor.

Why McD's? Because they are open 24 hours and I was hungry.

Kiev - Day 3.

I partied hard at Vodka bar till 5 am, got breakfast, and wrote a long ass expose' on my day, up until my laptop froze and I lost everything. Sorry, too tired and hung over to type it over.

Had date at apt. She brought the pizza, good times, I up'd the kino, and she gives me the fuckin' "I am a good girl" line. God bless you guys who fight thru the LMR, I don't have patience for that shit. I tell her she needs to go home. After I leave, I go thru my standard replies (I am looking for gf, we have no passion, etc.) 50% of the time, if I go on another date with the girl, she gives up the vagina. The other 50% I really don't give a shit about since I have a 22 yo law student waiting for my pleasure pole when I get back to the states.

TIP #1 - your game is always strongest when you are getting a steady source of pussy. The extra confidence (and lack of desperation) really makes it a lot easier to keep new pussy in the pipeline.

Ok - its 1230. I decide to pass on Caribbean club. Weds can be a good night there, a fair number of girls looking to hookup with a foreigner, but I pass. Been there, done that.

Arena - still seems sort of dead.

So I bounce to shooters. Its 1 am. Pretty packed, 50:50 ratio. A third of the girls are young and tight, definitely fuckable. One third are pro or semi pro. One thirds are older chicks that I would not fuck if my prostate depended on it.

My review: any girl that goes to Shooters on a Weds night is DTF. Girls making out with guys left and right. 80% of the guys are no competition whatsoever. Old or desperate looking. I run into a girl I met off of millionaire match.com. She starts to flirt with me, but I already knew she was a semi-pro, and she leaves with some douche. Had lots of fun though. 50% of the girls didn't speak english well enough to have a conversation, but were down to get the grind on.

Ok. It is a seedy environment but there are still targets in site. Everyone knows why they are there and its a cheap hookup. I think it is a viable alternative for a wednesday night. I was planning on going to Forsage later that night, but ended up leaving Shooters at 5 am.

@OhioNukes, what is this millionaire matchmaking site that you keep mentioning in your posts? Please share it with us, I am very curious...

Post: #233

(11-06-2014 11:11 AM)TripleG Wrote:  

(11-05-2014 10:05 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  Ok - to answer your questions. 1% US. Maybe closer to 0.1% but I don't really give a shit since I don't live that lifestyle. I am not Bill Gates. I have enough that I don't have to worry.

Why airbnb? Because I grew up dirt poor in a small town in ohio and sometimes it is hard to change one's ways. I might go to vegas and drop $10K on a table at a club, but a part of me is still frugal and remembers getting the free lunches in school because my family was so poor.

Why McD's? Because they are open 24 hours and I was hungry.

Kiev - Day 3.

I partied hard at Vodka bar till 5 am, got breakfast, and wrote a long ass expose' on my day, up until my laptop froze and I lost everything. Sorry, too tired and hung over to type it over.

Had date at apt. She brought the pizza, good times, I up'd the kino, and she gives me the fuckin' "I am a good girl" line. God bless you guys who fight thru the LMR, I don't have patience for that shit. I tell her she needs to go home. After I leave, I go thru my standard replies (I am looking for gf, we have no passion, etc.) 50% of the time, if I go on another date with the girl, she gives up the vagina. The other 50% I really don't give a shit about since I have a 22 yo law student waiting for my pleasure pole when I get back to the states.

TIP #1 - your game is always strongest when you are getting a steady source of pussy. The extra confidence (and lack of desperation) really makes it a lot easier to keep new pussy in the pipeline.

Ok - its 1230. I decide to pass on Caribbean club. Weds can be a good night there, a fair number of girls looking to hookup with a foreigner, but I pass. Been there, done that.

Arena - still seems sort of dead.

So I bounce to shooters. Its 1 am. Pretty packed, 50:50 ratio. A third of the girls are young and tight, definitely fuckable. One third are pro or semi pro. One thirds are older chicks that I would not fuck if my prostate depended on it.

My review: any girl that goes to Shooters on a Weds night is DTF. Girls making out with guys left and right. 80% of the guys are no competition whatsoever. Old or desperate looking. I run into a girl I met off of millionaire match.com. She starts to flirt with me, but I already knew she was a semi-pro, and she leaves with some douche. Had lots of fun though. 50% of the girls didn't speak english well enough to have a conversation, but were down to get the grind on.

Ok. It is a seedy environment but there are still targets in site. Everyone knows why they are there and its a cheap hookup. I think it is a viable alternative for a wednesday night. I was planning on going to Forsage later that night, but ended up leaving Shooters at 5 am.

@OhioNukes, what is this millionaire matchmaking site that you keep mentioning in your posts? Please share it with us, I am very curious...

It is called millionairematch.com. Most of the guys on there are not millionaires, most probably make less than $200K a year. It is better for some countries than others. You won't see the volume of women like you would on mamba or badoo, but I find a much lower flake rate. Of course, there are the gold diggers, more than other sites. In the USA, I have excellent success with the site.

Post: #234

(11-04-2014 10:22 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  

(11-04-2014 06:55 PM)Dantes Wrote:  

(11-04-2014 04:57 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  

(11-04-2014 02:47 PM)diego69 Wrote:  ohionukes, response rate and phone number harvesting both online and on day/night game are great in Kiev, even from 7 and 8, the challenge at least for me was how to convert the numbers to dates and how to convert dates to bangs.
So when just arriving to the city you are overwhelmed by this and the beauty and feel this could be pussy paradise while eventually amount of bangs will probably be low and require a lot of work.
I would be happy to hear how is it for you there.

My problem is time. If I lived here for a month or more, I would be swimming in bangs. Right now, I can easily convert 90-95% of the girls into dates. I find that some of them are getting very pushy (when are we meeting, why haven't you texted, etc). One girl actually got mad we didn't meet the first day I was here, and told me good luck with whomever I meet. Then a minute later wrote me back asking me if she can see me tomorrow. This is my 5th time to Kiev and I have NEVER seen the women here so aggressively wanting to go out on a date.

90-95% is off the chart in any country.

How are you meeting these girls? What is their level of attractiveness ?

Yes, not just meeting them, they are the ones hungry for the meetup. The economy right now is really poor. Despite the recent spike in patriotism, I find that the educated girls know they need to jump ship now. The stupid girls? They are still getting pumped and dumped by the locals guys left and riight. My dates are 7-9, average is an 8.5. I am surprised as anybody, I can't believe the change in environment. The educated attractive women want to get the fuck out of Ukraine as fast as possible. I predict once this current wave of girls emigrates, the response rate will drop significantly.

Pure bullshit. Ban worthy bullshit.

Post: #235

(11-06-2014 01:45 PM)NYoverSeas Wrote:  

(11-04-2014 10:22 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  

(11-04-2014 06:55 PM)Dantes Wrote:  

(11-04-2014 04:57 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  

(11-04-2014 02:47 PM)diego69 Wrote:  ohionukes, response rate and phone number harvesting both online and on day/night game are great in Kiev, even from 7 and 8, the challenge at least for me was how to convert the numbers to dates and how to convert dates to bangs.
So when just arriving to the city you are overwhelmed by this and the beauty and feel this could be pussy paradise while eventually amount of bangs will probably be low and require a lot of work.
I would be happy to hear how is it for you there.

My problem is time. If I lived here for a month or more, I would be swimming in bangs. Right now, I can easily convert 90-95% of the girls into dates. I find that some of them are getting very pushy (when are we meeting, why haven't you texted, etc). One girl actually got mad we didn't meet the first day I was here, and told me good luck with whomever I meet. Then a minute later wrote me back asking me if she can see me tomorrow. This is my 5th time to Kiev and I have NEVER seen the women here so aggressively wanting to go out on a date.

90-95% is off the chart in any country.

How are you meeting these girls? What is their level of attractiveness ?

Yes, not just meeting them, they are the ones hungry for the meetup. The economy right now is really poor. Despite the recent spike in patriotism, I find that the educated girls know they need to jump ship now. The stupid girls? They are still getting pumped and dumped by the locals guys left and riight. My dates are 7-9, average is an 8.5. I am surprised as anybody, I can't believe the change in environment. The educated attractive women want to get the fuck out of Ukraine as fast as possible. I predict once this current wave of girls emigrates, the response rate will drop significantly.

Pure bullshit. Ban worthy bullshit.

If I was saying I was converting all the numbers into bangs, that would be bullshit. The bang conversion is quite low. If I was bragging about a SNL every night of the week, that would be BS or I would be paying for it.

The one thing I failed to mention in the phone number to date conversion ratio is that I am asking less than 50% of the girls I get numbers from out on a date, choosing to focus on the targets that seem the most interested and target worthy, which is also probably skewing the results.

Regardless, the larger point is being missed. After the revolution, there was a lot of Ukrainian pride, and the desire to leave the country dropped. However, with the prolonged war in the east, and growing sentiment that promises of corruption reform won't work, that there is a definite uptick in the more educated women wanted to leave the country. These are not the girls you will be finding at shooters at 3 am.

Post: #236

(11-05-2014 08:13 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  

(11-05-2014 03:19 PM)The Texas Prophet Wrote:  

(11-05-2014 01:57 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  Yes the girls must be all wanting to leave now. Akula confirmed it. It is like 1996-1998 all over again. Those years were legend. Sorry we all missed it.

We have an encore now again, or I can sell you the Bklyn bridge.

However, I wouldn't be surprised that the girls have less chances to be wined and dined these days. You guys as foreigners with hard currency make the perfect escort . And a few more might be skilled at 'you scratch my back and I will scratch your back'.

If history is repeating itself I suspect the majority of visa/passport chasers are mothers with children. The majority of dinner whores is the same garden variety as usual.

If Ukraine's economy implodes next year (strong possibility considering they will probably default on their debt), then you could see a resurgence in Ukraine of the golden years of the late 90's once again.

Does that mean I will end up with another wife? hm..2 is better. J/K

If Ukraine's economy implodes, you could get yourself a harem

Sidenote: Now that Ukraine seems to be letting their currency free float again, the official exchange rate is approx. 14 UAH to 1 USD

Lord only knows what the blackmarket exchange rate is (15 or 16 UAH to 1 USD).

Ukraine is getting cheaper.

Post: #237

^^I sort of feel bad hoping for a return to this paradise of the past. But I would like to have the problem of handling a harem.

Post: #238

(11-06-2014 02:35 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  

(11-06-2014 01:45 PM)NYoverSeas Wrote:  

(11-04-2014 10:22 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  

(11-04-2014 06:55 PM)Dantes Wrote:  

(11-04-2014 04:57 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  My problem is time. If I lived here for a month or more, I would be swimming in bangs. Right now, I can easily convert 90-95% of the girls into dates. I find that some of them are getting very pushy (when are we meeting, why haven't you texted, etc). One girl actually got mad we didn't meet the first day I was here, and told me good luck with whomever I meet. Then a minute later wrote me back asking me if she can see me tomorrow. This is my 5th time to Kiev and I have NEVER seen the women here so aggressively wanting to go out on a date.

90-95% is off the chart in any country.

How are you meeting these girls? What is their level of attractiveness ?

Yes, not just meeting them, they are the ones hungry for the meetup. The economy right now is really poor. Despite the recent spike in patriotism, I find that the educated girls know they need to jump ship now. The stupid girls? They are still getting pumped and dumped by the locals guys left and riight. My dates are 7-9, average is an 8.5. I am surprised as anybody, I can't believe the change in environment. The educated attractive women want to get the fuck out of Ukraine as fast as possible. I predict once this current wave of girls emigrates, the response rate will drop significantly.

Pure bullshit. Ban worthy bullshit.

If I was saying I was converting all the numbers into bangs, that would be bullshit. The bang conversion is quite low. If I was bragging about a SNL every night of the week, that would be BS or I would be paying for it.

The one thing I failed to mention in the phone number to date conversion ratio is that I am asking less than 50% of the girls I get numbers from out on a date, choosing to focus on the targets that seem the most interested and target worthy, which is also probably skewing the results.

Regardless, the larger point is being missed. After the revolution, there was a lot of Ukrainian pride, and the desire to leave the country dropped. However, with the prolonged war in the east, and growing sentiment that promises of corruption reform won't work, that there is a definite uptick in the more educated women wanted to leave the country. These are not the girls you will be finding at shooters at 3 am.

I'm not disputing your conversion rate. It could match Jeff Hornacek's free throw percentage for all I know. I just find your average of 8.5 to be hogwash, and it has nothing to do with you personally but Kiev itself. I've grown tired of people pumping Kiev up to be some pussy paradise with model looking girls falling from the sky, misleading many drooling readers, when in fact it's anything but. Kiev is no better, or even worse, than many other European cities as far as what the average girl looks like. I have to attribute it to people either lying or them being very unfortunate by having to live in places where the girls are husky and masculine. Even with attraction being relative, Kiev is not a city that's swimming with gorgeous women when compared to other cities.

Post: #239

This might be out of context but OhioNukes posts made me think a bit about short-term travel for girls. I've been there and done that though the novelty is wearing off.

Recently due to the flue and being bed-ridden i've have had time to be philosophical and think about life. Here's a question for those who visit Ukraine or other EE destinations for short periods of time (under 2 weeks). Is it really worth it just for girls?
As I'm getting older and more immersed in my career with fewer off days I am finding this harder to justify.
Let's say one has been pipe-lining for weeks and has plenty of online date's lined-up with slavic beauties, in addition to that for those rare evenings where one does not have an online date you find yourself going to night-clubs and having the "time of your life", making temporary friends and making money rain in night clubs. You get more attention from women than you would back home. You end up scoring with beauties a full 2 points higher than you would in USA. So for those 6 or 7 days that you're in the country you are "walking on cloud 9".

Then during afternoon's, you sip coffee and walk the wide boulevards by Olimpiysky stadium, see museums, engage in a little history reading, call up your date from previous night and ask her to give you a "walking tour" of the city. You find out she is busy, so then you day-game as you have plenty of time to kill. You do OK and get several numbers but no insta-dates. So, these date's end up happening in the next day or two (and you are upset because the girls again are busy since it is a work day for them) and you are always watching your clock as you know you have another date lined up and limited time in the country.

Then what's next? For me every time I travel either my heart get's broken or I get depressed (having to go back home so soon) and same thing happens to a local girl(s). Frequently, the relationships I built-up end up turning into long-distance relationships which fizzle out. By the time I come back that girl either has a "better deal" or wants just to be friends.

I might be in the minority of the guys on this forum but the "pump n' dump" strategy does not appeal to me and does not justify the great commitment in time and money involved in traveling so far.

How do you guys reconcile this? Is the only "happy" alternative to look for LTR's who might be willing to relocate/visit you in your home country? Please advise.

Post: #240

^^^well there is the old 90 fiance visa scam if you play THEM before they play you.
But I think you need more time there tbh. It has been recommended that it isn't a great short time place.

I use to read Greek Kamaki stories how he would go for 3-4 days and spend like 1.5-2k and got at most 2 lays. Never made sense to me. I mean the guy lived in EU. He could have gamed in his own country and if he didn't score he could have fucked in one of those German sex clubs for a fraction of the cost. Kind of how Americans end up in strip clubs at the end of the night lol.

For a guy that believed in pussy economics his arithmetic was absurd lol.
Maybe you should just travel around the world..for travel sake and of course game in your free time.

Maybe you should save a few grand from missing a trip and use it to BEAUTIFY yourself(spa, skin treatment, surgery, whatever). Perhaps, this way you can game younger and a few points higher where you live?

Remember age doesn't matter...only what age you tell them!

Post: #241

TripleG - great post and yes I get the same feeling.
Travelling is an expensive drug, which doesn't always get you high.
The only solution is to be location independent or located in Western Europe, which I have done the latter and strongly contemplating again.
As you know when you have tasted the fine wine in those region, it's hard to adjust to the stuff they serve back home.

Post: #242

I would agree with most of the prior posts. Its 4 am and I am buzzed, but I will try to be coherent.

I completely agree about the quality of women. I do NOT think the quality of women in Ukraine that much greater than most other countries. I think it is fun to come to the FSU/EE, but the quality of women I date in the USA is better than I date in the FSU.

Night game in the FSU is low yield to the same extent as the USA. I am average in looks, look 15 years younger than I am, but we must all play to our strengths. If I approach a girl during day game or night game, there is no way for her to know I have multiple advanced degrees and a 1%'re. The waterfront property, the boats, etc cannot be communicated without looking desperate.

That is why I find the internet provides the greatest ROI for a man of means. In the time it takes you to day game 10 girls, I can internet game 200 girls. It is just a better investment of my time. For an older guy who has a lot to offer, the internet is a much better approach than day game.

And it also allows me to game the top 10% of any country. The girls who are 8.5+ do not routinely go clubbing - they are tired of being hit on by drunks russians, turks, etc. I have gone out with them and they all tell me the same story - when they go out, they get assaulted all night long.

I realized tonight that there is this binary way of thinking among the women. You are either a "party girl" or you are not. There is no moderation. When the girls are young, they party, get drunk and can't walk, fuck stupid shit, and then they stop. The concept of moderation seems foreign to most girls - that you can go out to a bar, not get shit-faced and fuck a douche, go home alone and have be a good girl. You are either a party girl, or you are almost a nun.

But I digress.

Keiv - Day 3 or 4 or something. Things are getting blurry.

So I have a date with someone from OKcupid. From the pics, slim body with big tits. In person, that was true. But the face was a 6 and I am a face guy. We have dinner at TGIFridays just because I was too lazy to look up any other places to eat. I decided off the bat I didn't really care to invest any time in her to get a flag, although I could tell she was very interested. I usually use these times to gather intel. I ask her what it is like dating, what she and her girlfriends are looking for, what internet sites they use, etc etc, hoping to gather further insight into the FSU mentality which I still have not completely figured out and probably never will.

Dinner was ok (as ok as one can get at TGIFridays). The date wants to walk me to my apt, which seems weird. When I get there, I thank her for the night and say goodbye. In retrospect, I guess she wanted an invite to the apt, by I just wasn't into her.

Go to Arena. Pop my head into Skybar. Thursday night is karaoke night. 8-10 hotties (8+) in groups, I don't see potential there rolling solo, so I bounce without paying cover.

Taxi driver recommends Caribbean club. Recently I have lost interest here, too many douche bags and average girls and pros. When I get there, 5 hotties on the floor. 75:25 female to male ratio. I hear some american being spoken, and befriend 3 cool young guys from the embassy and an american chick. It was great hanging out with them, lots of insight into local scene.

Apparently, most russian guys will just walk up to a hot girl and say "Lets leave here and fuck." Literally. That is why all the bitch shields from the hotties. One of the guys has a 56 year old friend (looks younger) who is puling hotties left and right. His secret - go up to a girl and say "Hi. How is your day going?" That simple approach, rather than asking them if they want to fuck, apparently is quite successful. Lesson learned.

Intel - Caribbrean Club on a Thursday night. 6-8 young, friendly hotties on the dance floor at 11 pm. Here is the kicker. As the evening progressed, as more people arrived, the ratios remained the same until 3 am. I had a great time with a older (40) polish guy who was gaming two sisters. The younger sister (20?) was into me, but she spoke no english. She kept pulling me to the dance floor, and thankfully not a pro or even semipro. I thought about trying to close on her, but I was pretty sure she was not there to fuck (unlike her older sister), plus I was tired and had a lunch date the next day with a model type. If I thought I could have pulled both sisters, I would have but after 4 nights of hard core night gaming to 4-5 am, it is starting to wear on me.

I saw two pros at the club. One approached me and I just told her I hate blondes and eventually she went away. 90% of the girls were non-pro, and I think this is a viable option for a thursday night.

To my other older men of means: I enjoy coming to the FSU, for several reasons. To a large extent, I just like getting "off the grid". I am a foreigner in a foreign land and I walk around listening to my iPod and checking out different historical or cultural sites and getting away from it all. Second, it is actually sort of fun to flake on chicks. I could provide most of these girls a life they will probably never experience, and it is sort of fun to just say "fuck 'em". If they think their pussy don't stink, then they can settle for a ukrainian man. Probably unlike many other men, I enjoy dating american women and I find there is less headache and hassle dating them then flying to the FSU and trying to convince some dumb ass girl making $250 USD a month I am not a sex tourist. Fuck her. I feel like Roosh sometime (or at least I think so). After I am here for 3-4 days, I am ready to leave and get back to the states, and after in the states for 4-5 months, I start thinking about coming back to Kiev even though I promised myself I wouldn't.

Post: #243

(11-06-2014 07:51 PM)TripleG Wrote:  This might be out of context but OhioNukes posts made me think a bit about short-term travel for girls. I've been there and done that though the novelty is wearing off.

Recently due to the flue and being bed-ridden i've have had time to be philosophical and think about life. Here's a question for those who visit Ukraine or other EE destinations for short periods of time (under 2 weeks). Is it really worth it just for girls?
As I'm getting older and more immersed in my career with fewer off days I am finding this harder to justify.
Let's say one has been pipe-lining for weeks and has plenty of online date's lined-up with slavic beauties, in addition to that for those rare evenings where one does not have an online date you find yourself going to night-clubs and having the "time of your life", making temporary friends and making money rain in night clubs. You get more attention from women than you would back home. You end up scoring with beauties a full 2 points higher than you would in USA. So for those 6 or 7 days that you're in the country you are "walking on cloud 9".

Then during afternoon's, you sip coffee and walk the wide boulevards by Olimpiysky stadium, see museums, engage in a little history reading, call up your date from previous night and ask her to give you a "walking tour" of the city. You find out she is busy, so then you day-game as you have plenty of time to kill. You do OK and get several numbers but no insta-dates. So, these date's end up happening in the next day or two (and you are upset because the girls again are busy since it is a work day for them) and you are always watching your clock as you know you have another date lined up and limited time in the country.

Then what's next? For me every time I travel either my heart get's broken or I get depressed (having to go back home so soon) and same thing happens to a local girl(s). Frequently, the relationships I built-up end up turning into long-distance relationships which fizzle out. By the time I come back that girl either has a "better deal" or wants just to be friends.

I might be in the minority of the guys on this forum but the "pump n' dump" strategy does not appeal to me and does not justify the great commitment in time and money involved in traveling so far.

How do you guys reconcile this? Is the only "happy" alternative to look for LTR's who might be willing to relocate/visit you in your home country? Please advise.

I 100% feel where you are coming from - I feel exactly the same way. The novelty is wearing off. The smartest, more beautiful, kind women I have dated have been in america (even though several were born in different countries). When I go overseas, there is no change in the attractiveness of the women I date, in fact, I find it easier to date 8+ women in the USA. Easier by a large margin. I am seriously contemplating getting out of the foreign game. It was fun, but I don't see it adding much to the quality of my life, and the value of my time is becoming increasing more important.

Post: #244

(11-06-2014 08:12 PM)jimukr104 Wrote:  ^^^well there is the old 90 fiance visa scam if you play THEM before they play you.
But I think you need more time there tbh. It has been recommended that it isn't a great short time place.

I use to read Greek Kamaki stories how he would go for 3-4 days and spend like 1.5-2k and got at most 2 lays. Never made sense to me. I mean the guy lived in EU. He could have gamed in his own country and if he didn't score he could have fucked in one of those German sex clubs for a fraction of the cost. Kind of how Americans end up in strip clubs at the end of the night lol.

For a guy that believed in pussy economics his arithmetic was absurd lol.

Did Kamaki hit up Ukraine in the 90s? Back then, spending 1.5-2K in 3-4 days in Ukraine would have put him at baller status.

If he was doing a "gifts for sex" game, I would have expected his bang to cash ratio to be higher.

Post: #245

^^^Those figures are his costs from his recent trips. But it includes airfare and hotel. He then says he spends 200-250 a night in entertainment lol

Post: #246

(11-06-2014 09:27 PM)ohionukes Wrote:  I would agree with most of the prior posts. Its 4 am and I am buzzed, but I will try to be coherent.

I completely agree about the quality of women. I do NOT think the quality of women in Ukraine that much greater than most other countries. I think it is fun to come to the FSU/EE, but the quality of women I date in the USA is better than I date in the FSU.

Night game in the FSU is low yield to the same extent as the USA. I am average in looks, look 15 years younger than I am, but we must all play to our strengths. If I approach a girl during day game or night game, there is no way for her to know I have multiple advanced degrees and a 1%'re. The waterfront property, the boats, etc cannot be communicated without looking desperate.

That is why I find the internet provides the greatest ROI for a man of means. In the time it takes you to day game 10 girls, I can internet game 200 girls. It is just a better investment of my time. For an older guy who has a lot to offer, the internet is a much better approach than day game.

And it also allows me to game the top 10% of any country. The girls who are 8.5+ do not routinely go clubbing - they are tired of being hit on by drunks russians, turks, etc. I have gone out with them and they all tell me the same story - when they go out, they get assaulted all night long.

I realized tonight that there is this binary way of thinking among the women. You are either a "party girl" or you are not. There is no moderation. When the girls are young, they party, get drunk and can't walk, fuck stupid shit, and then they stop. The concept of moderation seems foreign to most girls - that you can go out to a bar, not get shit-faced and fuck a douche, go home alone and have be a good girl. You are either a party girl, or you are almost a nun.

But I digress.

Keiv - Day 3 or 4 or something. Things are getting blurry.

So I have a date with someone from OKcupid. From the pics, slim body with big tits. In person, that was true. But the face was a 6 and I am a face guy. We have dinner at TGIFridays just because I was too lazy to look up any other places to eat. I decided off the bat I didn't really care to invest any time in her to get a flag, although I could tell she was very interested. I usually use these times to gather intel. I ask her what it is like dating, what she and her girlfriends are looking for, what internet sites they use, etc etc, hoping to gather further insight into the FSU mentality which I still have not completely figured out and probably never will.

Dinner was ok (as ok as one can get at TGIFridays). The date wants to walk me to my apt, which seems weird. When I get there, I thank her for the night and say goodbye. In retrospect, I guess she wanted an invite to the apt, by I just wasn't into her.

Go to Arena. Pop my head into Skybar. Thursday night is karaoke night. 8-10 hotties (8+) in groups, I don't see potential there rolling solo, so I bounce without paying cover.

Taxi driver recommends Caribbean club. Recently I have lost interest here, too many douche bags and average girls and pros. When I get there, 5 hotties on the floor. 75:25 female to male ratio. I hear some american being spoken, and befriend 3 cool young guys from the embassy and an american chick. It was great hanging out with them, lots of insight into local scene.

Apparently, most russian guys will just walk up to a hot girl and say "Lets leave here and fuck." Literally. That is why all the bitch shields from the hotties. One of the guys has a 56 year old friend (looks younger) who is puling hotties left and right. His secret - go up to a girl and say "Hi. How is your day going?" That simple approach, rather than asking them if they want to fuck, apparently is quite successful. Lesson learned.

Intel - Caribbrean Club on a Thursday night. 6-8 young, friendly hotties on the dance floor at 11 pm. Here is the kicker. As the evening progressed, as more people arrived, the ratios remained the same until 3 am. I had a great time with a older (40) polish guy who was gaming two sisters. The younger sister (20?) was into me, but she spoke no english. She kept pulling me to the dance floor, and thankfully not a pro or even semipro. I thought about trying to close on her, but I was pretty sure she was not there to fuck (unlike her older sister), plus I was tired and had a lunch date the next day with a model type. If I thought I could have pulled both sisters, I would have but after 4 nights of hard core night gaming to 4-5 am, it is starting to wear on me.

I saw two pros at the club. One approached me and I just told her I hate blondes and eventually she went away. 90% of the girls were non-pro, and I think this is a viable option for a thursday night.

To my other older men of means: I enjoy coming to the FSU, for several reasons. To a large extent, I just like getting "off the grid". I am a foreigner in a foreign land and I walk around listening to my iPod and checking out different historical or cultural sites and getting away from it all. Second, it is actually sort of fun to flake on chicks. I could provide most of these girls a life they will probably never experience, and it is sort of fun to just say "fuck 'em". If they think their pussy don't stink, then they can settle for a ukrainian man. Probably unlike many other men, I enjoy dating american women and I find there is less headache and hassle dating them then flying to the FSU and trying to convince some dumb ass girl making $250 USD a month I am not a sex tourist. Fuck her. I feel like Roosh sometime (or at least I think so). After I am here for 3-4 days, I am ready to leave and get back to the states, and after in the states for 4-5 months, I start thinking about coming back to Kiev even though I promised myself I wouldn't.

Thank you. Finally, some sanity that's not tainted with novelty or rose colored glasses. I see guys all the time on this site bashing American women as if they're orks, then I wonder where they're from or have been. I'm from NYC and I've been traveling since spring all throughout Europe and haven't been in a city that trumps NY in terms of attractiveness and volume of said attractiveness, objectively speaking, of course. I don't play favorites and don't think that where I'm from is the end all, be all.

I've been to one place here in Kiev that slightly resembled what I'd see back home and that was in Decadence on a Saturday night. About four girls who look like they could be actual models.

People on here also rave about how these girls dress. Yeah, they wear heels and a bunch of make-up, but if you're from a top tier city where that's common, you can tell the difference if you're familiar with fashion. You can see their wardrobe is cheaply made knock-offs, and understandably so, knowing the economic situation. It's not an indictment on them but more-so than on those who place these girls on a pedal stool.

The problem with any time of day gaming here is that hardly anyone knows English. The ones that do or claim they do are remedial at best. So you're stuck completing their sentences because they pause so much to find the right words or correcting them if they seek to improve. Even if you knew Russian/Ukrainian, you'd just be banging a bunch of mid-level talent. And why would anyone travel thousands of miles to do that unless they're unable to procure sex anywhere else? But then again I digress, because life is contextual. If you're from a place that's not a megatropolis, then these girls probably aren't mid-level to you, but a huge upgrade.

Post: #247

Ohionukes so much of what you say is the polar opposite of my experiences in 10 years of going to Ukraine

Quote:If I lived here for a month or more, I would be swimming in bangs. Right now, I can easily convert 90-95% of the girls into dates.

That's just bull, the flake rate in Ukraine is big, you could not even get that percentage of girls to turn up. You also describe yourself as average looking, either these girls are rough looking or you are went to the same school of game as Greek Kamaki

Quote:This is my 5th time to Kiev and I have NEVER seen the women here so aggressively wanting to go out on a date.

I rarely had girls aggressively asking me for a date, it's not in their culture, and i'm a decent looking guy in my 30's. Why are they so desperate to date you if you are average looking and i'm guessing in your 40's/50's?

Quote:I do NOT think the quality of women in Ukraine that much greater than most other countries. I think it is fun to come to the FSU/EE, but the quality of women I date in the USA is better than I date in the FSU.

Ok maybe if you went to a major capital like London, Paris, New York and go to the fanciest nightclubs then you can see plenty of stunning women, most of those will be Eastern European. But in Ukraine they are everywhere, you don't even need to go to these places, they are everywhere at any time of day. Whats-more they are approachable, open, and obesity is almost non existent.

With regard to you dating hotter chicks in USA, I don't doubt you. You cannot seduce many girls, with intelligence, humour, style etc in Ukraine because of the language barrier, and the fact the girls are rather dumb

Quote:less girls are hungry and are pursuing me stronger than I am pursuing them. I jumped on Tinder at 1130 at the bar - response rate was great considering the hour. I chatted up 6 girls on Tinder while I was at Vodka bar. The response rate blew away the response rate I got in Krakow Poland. I am using Tinder just to see if I can find a girl who want to get laid that night, I really don't have time for anything else, but hope springs eternal.

What kind of profile do you have online to make you so desirable?, if you are just looking for a quick bang when pipe lining, then I presume these girls are probably 6's?

It seems clear to me you are playing the money game, please let us know how you game these chicks into being all over you. A sports jacket and a Rolex usually doesn't cut it

Post: #248

(11-07-2014 03:31 AM)TheMusketeer Wrote:  Ohionukes so much of what you say is the polar opposite of my experiences in 10 years of going to Ukraine

Quote:If I lived here for a month or more, I would be swimming in bangs. Right now, I can easily convert 90-95% of the girls into dates.

That's just bull, the flake rate in Ukraine is big, you could not even get that percentage of girls to turn up. You also describe yourself as average looking, either these girls are rough looking or you are went to the same school of game as Greek Kamaki

Quote:This is my 5th time to Kiev and I have NEVER seen the women here so aggressively wanting to go out on a date.

I rarely had girls aggressively asking me for a date, it's not in their culture, and i'm a decent looking guy in my 30's. Why are they so desperate to date you if you are average looking and i'm guessing in your 40's/50's?

Quote:I do NOT think the quality of women in Ukraine that much greater than most other countries. I think it is fun to come to the FSU/EE, but the quality of women I date in the USA is better than I date in the FSU.

Ok maybe if you went to a major capital like London, Paris, New York and go to the fanciest nightclubs then you can see plenty of stunning women, most of those will be Eastern European. But in Ukraine they are everywhere, you don't even need to go to these places, they are everywhere at any time of day. Whats-more they are approachable, open, and obesity is almost non existent.

With regard to you dating hotter chicks in USA, I don't doubt you. You cannot seduce many girls, with intelligence, humour, style etc in Ukraine because of the language barrier, and the fact the girls are rather dumb

Quote:less girls are hungry and are pursuing me stronger than I am pursuing them. I jumped on Tinder at 1130 at the bar - response rate was great considering the hour. I chatted up 6 girls on Tinder while I was at Vodka bar. The response rate blew away the response rate I got in Krakow Poland. I am using Tinder just to see if I can find a girl who want to get laid that night, I really don't have time for anything else, but hope springs eternal.

What kind of profile do you have online to make you so desirable?, if you are just looking for a quick bang when pipe lining, then I presume these girls are probably 6's?

It seems clear to me you are playing the money game, please let us know how you game these chicks into being all over you. A sports jacket and a Rolex usually doesn't cut it

I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with that statement in bold. Sorry. You must think average girls are hot.

Also, the hottest girls in NYC are not Eastern European. They're actually Americans with American accents of all different ethnicities. And you don't have to go to fancy clubs in NY to see stunning girls. All you have to do is go shopping, go to a movie, go to a bar, Central Park, 5th Ave, Rockefeller Center, Herald Square, etc.

Post: #249

Hate to jump in this, but...Women in Ukraine are skinnier on average than in America. That is an undeniable fact, anyone who says otherwise is either trolling or kookoo for coco puffs.

As for NYC, what do you mean by NYC? Queens isn't full of attractive women. Nor is the Bronx. Nor is Staten Island (unless you like guidettes). And only the hipper parts of Brooklyn have hotties.

When people say NYC, they usually mean Manhattan. Needs to be an apples to apples comparison. Comparing all of Kiev to just Manhattan is a bit unrealistic.

Post: #250

(11-07-2014 04:27 AM)The Texas Prophet Wrote:  Hate to jump in this, but...Women in Ukraine are skinnier on average than in America. That is an undeniable fact, anyone who says otherwise is either trolling or kookoo for coco puffs.

As for NYC, what do you mean by NYC? Queens isn't full of attractive women. Nor is the Bronx. Nor is Staten Island (unless you like guidettes).

When people say NYC, they usually mean Manhattan. Needs to be an apples to apples comparison.

Since when does skinny equate all around physical beauty? And the only girls that are fat in NY are blacks and latinas for the most part. From what I understand America is pretty obese, but since I don't live in the entirety of America, I wouldn't know.

When anyone speaks of NYC, who refers to Queens and the Bronx? And people from NY don't even consider Staten Island NYC. No one every goes there. Ever. Unless you live there.

For those of you who exalt these Ukrainian girls, please use your phone cameras with you when you hit the streets and post pictures of these so called 8's, 9's and 10's. I'm really interested in your rating systems. The reckless abandon that's used on this site to pump up mediocrity is perplexing.