Post: #26

(02-26-2014 06:29 AM)DrugAdvisor Wrote:  Step 1: open a brokerage account charging low commission fees.

Step 2: put 10-30% of your spare cash from hustles into the account and buy index funds. Create another bank acc to store 10-20% into it as your rainy day fund.

Step 3: repeat step 2 once every 3-4 months. For as long as possible.

Step 4: when u see blood on the streets (typically occurs once around 7-10 years), calmly withdraw half of your cash from rainy day fund and pile on your discounted index fund.

Step 5: repeat all of the above while looking for bonds that you prefer that yields between 3-6% easy.

Work out exactly how much passive income u want:

100/3 x (yearly passive income desired) = max target for your index fund

Cash out and enjoy life.

DrugAdvisor - while your posted strategy is academically sound, it would likely take forever. Although this is what they teach in undergrad finance class, the academics are usually 15 years behind...so, sometime soon they are going to have to pitch this idea. I mean, if you want some passive income when you are 65...go for it. If you want to enjoy some mailbox money while your dick still works, I'd recommend changing this game up.

I frankly think generating truly passive income is tough.

Example: I invested as an LP in someone else's deal. Because they have to do all the work (put deal together, engage an operator, interact with operator, etc.) all I can expect to get is a 6% coupon and if things go well I double my money at exit after 5yrs. (and when I say, double, this includes the 5yrs of coupons so it isn't as sexy as it sounds).

But, if you invest as an LP as a way to learn how to replicate this deal as the GP...in all reality this type of deal could probably be managed with 10 hours a week of work. By definition you are an "active" investor as the GP, but the recurring revenue is now of an amount that is probably meaningful.

If we are all looking for some "mailbox money", then a truly passive investment strategy will not likely get you there anytime soon (even in private deals). Investing in the market for sure won't get you there anytime soon.

So, my vote is to add a little elbow grease to the "passive" investment and make it "active", but not so active that it can't be easily managed from afar.

Post: #27

(02-27-2014 01:45 AM)anonymous123 Wrote:  =

DrugAdvisor - while your posted strategy is academically sound, it would likely take forever. Although this is what they teach in undergrad finance class, the academics are usually 15 years behind...so, sometime soon they are going to have to pitch this idea. I mean, if you want some passive income when you are 65...go for it. If you want to enjoy some mailbox money while your dick still works, I'd recommend changing this game up.

It depends how much you are investing a year. If you are invest 5k monthly it will add up really fast. If you are investing 500 dollars a month its going to take a long time.

Post: #28

(02-27-2014 03:38 AM)lavidaloca Wrote:  

(02-27-2014 01:45 AM)anonymous123 Wrote:  =

DrugAdvisor - while your posted strategy is academically sound, it would likely take forever. Although this is what they teach in undergrad finance class, the academics are usually 15 years behind...so, sometime soon they are going to have to pitch this idea. I mean, if you want some passive income when you are 65...go for it. If you want to enjoy some mailbox money while your dick still works, I'd recommend changing this game up.

It depends how much you are investing a year. If you are invest 5k monthly it will add up really fast. If you are investing 500 dollars a month its going to take a long time.

Even at $5k/month, if you were so lucky to average an 8% return year over year, you are looking at north of 10 years to set aside $1 million. And, if you are also lucky you will have a situation where you can pull a 6% coupon off of that million to give you $60k/year of passive income.

I'm just saying, for someone that can set aside $60k/year for investment...there are better ways to go about it if the goal is to have an income stream that is set up for using to supplement your lifestyle.

If this thread were the "how do I make sure I save properly for retirement" I'd be with you...but given the context of this whole forum...I don't think that proper/prudent retirement savings plan is the goal.

Post: #29

I'm with anon123. It seems everyone is focused on passive income and that requires a lot of money. I think the reason is because it smells of freedom and that is what people really want.

If they could generate the same cashflow with minimum work then we are still talking about freedom.

It's all about the cashflow.

Post: #30

^ I am with you guys.

You need to build a platform.

You have to run the math, if I continue down this path am I going to get what I want.

As an example, $2M in your 20s is worth far more than $70M in your 70s you're already dead.

You want to maximize life time spending totals. Ie life time fun.

Post: #31

(02-26-2014 11:29 PM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  Yeah, Donald Trump should be giving away free rent because he is rich now. No reason for him to continue making money. People deserve free stuff because they just do. Besides, people actually value free stuff far more than when they pay for it. Hell, college should be free.

That is an entitlement mentality right there. You expect successful people to just hand over information for free simply because they are more successful than you. That type of thinking will not help you in real life.

What I mean is that the marginal benefit is basically zero, so why charge? If you have 100 mln in the bank, then making another 200k is not going to change your lifestyle one bit.

I don't see this as an entitled thing, just.. why waste time hustling to sell a book if you don't need the money? Why not just write the book, give it away for free, and use the extra time (from not hustling to sell it) to enjoy life more?

The Trump example isn't quite the same. Giving away free apartments isn't spreading his knowledge on how to make money at real estate.

Post: #32

(02-27-2014 11:18 PM)paninaro Wrote:  

(02-26-2014 11:29 PM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  Yeah, Donald Trump should be giving away free rent because he is rich now. No reason for him to continue making money. People deserve free stuff because they just do. Besides, people actually value free stuff far more than when they pay for it. Hell, college should be free.

That is an entitlement mentality right there. You expect successful people to just hand over information for free simply because they are more successful than you. That type of thinking will not help you in real life.

What I mean is that the marginal benefit is basically zero, so why charge? If you have 100 mln in the bank, then making another 200k is not going to change your lifestyle one bit.

I don't see this as an entitled thing, just.. why waste time hustling to sell a book if you don't need the money? Why not just write the book, give it away for free, and use the extra time (from not hustling to sell it) to enjoy life more?

The Trump example isn't quite the same. Giving away free apartments isn't spreading his knowledge on how to make money at real estate.

I understand where you're coming from but still disagree with the mentality. You are pulling numbers out of thin air so let's stick to motivations instead.

It may or may not be about money. It could be about fame. Books still cost money to distribute/market and publishers will want to make money off of sales. The proceeds of sales could be donated to charity. Some people, like me, think that most people don't respect free information. Some people, like me, think our time is valuable and at least should be compensated for spending a good deal writing a book or course (these are not easy, especially if you don't have experience writing) even if 200k is a drop in the bucket.

You don't really know but you're automatically disqualifying them because they are multi millionaires and they won't make as much off of their book sales as they do in their normal day to day business.

To dismiss someone based on a rather flimsy logical stance is only hurting yourself. But hey, I learn something from everything I purchase even if the writer isn't a multi millionaire. That is what people should be concerned about. If the material will fit in their goal. I only need to learn one new thing to make it worth my time and money. That one thing could bring in a lot of money and stuff like that has for me.

Post: #33

There is nothing wrong with saving up 1M if you need 60k a year to retire...

However you got to take a close look at your expenses to see what they will be when you retire and more importantly where you retire. Maybe you won't be paying for an apartment in the business center, commuting expenses, business clothes, etc.

Retiring in SEA or EE you might only need 20k a year in investment income which is much easier to achieve.

Not only that 99 percent of the posters here are intelligent and would probably go crazy without some kind of project even after "retiring". You don't want to let your mind rot away so you can do some fun projects on the side to supplement your income.

I mean just partying and banging sluts is awesome but eventually you're going want to build something again especially if you're in your 20s-40s. It is unshakeable masculine trait.

Post: #34

(02-27-2014 11:18 PM)paninaro Wrote:  

(02-26-2014 11:29 PM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  Yeah, Donald Trump should be giving away free rent because he is rich now. No reason for him to continue making money. People deserve free stuff because they just do. Besides, people actually value free stuff far more than when they pay for it. Hell, college should be free.

That is an entitlement mentality right there. You expect successful people to just hand over information for free simply because they are more successful than you. That type of thinking will not help you in real life.

What I mean is that the marginal benefit is basically zero, so why charge? If you have 100 mln in the bank, then making another 200k is not going to change your lifestyle one bit.

I don't see this as an entitled thing, just.. why waste time hustling to sell a book if you don't need the money? Why not just write the book, give it away for free, and use the extra time (from not hustling to sell it) to enjoy life more?

The Trump example isn't quite the same. Giving away free apartments isn't spreading his knowledge on how to make money at real estate.

1)even if people wanted to give their books away for free, publishing companies wouldn't let them, and since you need publishing companies to even get the word out that you exist (the mass marketing costs are in the millions), you're going to have to charge for the book. People will take the book seriously if its on some sort of bestseller list, which means you'll have to sell the book anyway, leading me to the rest of this post. . .

2)these publishing companies will want to profit form their investment, it keeps their employess fed and clothed

3(the most important reason) "The game is sold, not told"
no, this is not because "rich people are greedy" its a more fundamental truth:

People value what they've had to pay for, when you charge for a "self help book", consulting, advice etc, these people who buy it are the ones ASKING for that advice.

This is important because:
1)If you offer people advice that they are not asking for, they will not listen, and often get angry at you, further wasting your time, and preventing you from getting to the people who need your help, don't believe me? Just try preaching to your beta male freinds about how to get lots of women/game/red pill/etc etc(it's all the same thing really). Come back in the morning and tell us how that went.

2)If you offer something like "how to get rich" for free, and include all of the processes, you'll realize that it takes a lot of effort, it's not all "Snap your fingers and money comes out of the sky" further discouraging people from going down that road, if those people had been inspired enough to pay for that info... to "Invest" themselves in it, then they are more likely to go about following those steps.

3)The process to getting rich, ARE LONG PROCESSES, it's not something you can do in a day, more like years. Outlining ways for each of these takes a large book on each subject information wise. if you notice what I said in #1 and #2 you'd realize that this is not what everyone wants. Once they find the "method" they are less likely to go through with it (again #2)

If you can't realize the value of paying for something, then you will forever be poor. As paying for things that give value to you. . .and paying well for those things, WILL extend to ANY endeavour you decide to undertake to become wealthy. If you can't or wont pay your people well . . .or rather "what they're worth"(especially at the start of whatever venture you do)then you can't expect them to be able to create wealth for you.

So always asking for things for free, IS a poor man's mindset, as people like that don't know the value of paying for quality. . .in all things they consume, be it information or something more tangible.

This is why "self help" books/products aren't free.

Also This is why Pimps always say: "The game is SOLD, not TOLD" No pimp is going to want to waste time taking someone under his wing if he's going to waste his time. The space is not as easy as it seems.

How deep down the rabit hole do you really want to go?

Or rather, how far are you REALLY willing to go?

You're really going to have to check yourself and your mindset before you can even start making money. People like you would win the lottery and then lose all that money and be broke in a year.

Post: #35

(02-28-2014 01:20 AM)CJ_W Wrote:  People like you would win the lottery and then lose all that money and be broke in a year.

People who do not respect just how difficult it is to earn wealth, by their having actually accomplished that goal, are -- by far -- the worst stewards of money.

Post: #36

(02-27-2014 11:58 PM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  

(02-27-2014 11:18 PM)paninaro Wrote:  

(02-26-2014 11:29 PM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  Yeah, Donald Trump should be giving away free rent because he is rich now. No reason for him to continue making money. People deserve free stuff because they just do. Besides, people actually value free stuff far more than when they pay for it. Hell, college should be free.

That is an entitlement mentality right there. You expect successful people to just hand over information for free simply because they are more successful than you. That type of thinking will not help you in real life.

What I mean is that the marginal benefit is basically zero, so why charge? If you have 100 mln in the bank, then making another 200k is not going to change your lifestyle one bit.

I don't see this as an entitled thing, just.. why waste time hustling to sell a book if you don't need the money? Why not just write the book, give it away for free, and use the extra time (from not hustling to sell it) to enjoy life more?

The Trump example isn't quite the same. Giving away free apartments isn't spreading his knowledge on how to make money at real estate.

I understand where you're coming from but still disagree with the mentality. You are pulling numbers out of thin air so let's stick to motivations instead.

It may or may not be about money. It could be about fame. Books still cost money to distribute/market and publishers will want to make money off of sales. The proceeds of sales could be donated to charity. Some people, like me, think that most people don't respect free information. Some people, like me, think our time is valuable and at least should be compensated for spending a good deal writing a book or course (these are not easy, especially if you don't have experience writing) even if 200k is a drop in the bucket.

Ok if it's about fame that's a different goal and that makes sense.

What I was getting at here is that at some point the marginal benefit of $X more money is basically 0. I have a friend who has done very well in his life (multi-millionaire), and he's asked to speak at universities and to young people all the time. They often offer to pay him a speaker's fee and his travel costs, and he always turns down any compensation and just does it for free. The reason is making another $1k will make no difference in his life or lifestyle, and he likes spreading his knowledge and motivating people.

I suppose it can be a bit different with a book because there are more costs involved, and it can take a lot more time.. just some of those "I'm rich, you can be too" books make me skeptical. I guess if I were in that situation, I'd just donate all profits to charity.

Post: #37

(02-28-2014 02:04 AM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  People who do not respect just how difficult it is to earn wealth, by their having actually accomplished that goal, are -- by far -- the worst stewards of money.

Someone spoke to me once about what they would do if they were wealthy. They were not. I don't think this person understood how hard it is to make your own fortune from nothing. Those that have become successful know how much stress, pain, frustration and sacrifices was involved. It is much easier to spend imaginary money than real money. When I spend money I remind myself what it took to get it (not all the time - just larger purchases/transactions).

Post: #38

Panarino and WWT based on my reading of this I think you guys are talking past each other.

You guys can correct me if I'm wrong.

Wwt is saying you shouldn't expect a rich man just to give you shit for free (As an example... Taxes i know that's your favorite topic wwt!). True.

Panarino is basically saying if he personally was wealthy he would use the book for charity (also has friends who do this in the form of speeches). Also true. Look no further than that video of massive takedown of a feminist when the guy was there on the cheap versus the short haired weirdo chick.

These are different topics because you are both right. 1) don't expect rich people to give you shit for free and 2) running a charity is a legit thing the mega rich do and panarino is saying he would write a book on making money and just give it away.

Now here is the rub. When people pay for something they are more likely to listen.This is counter intuitive and why many people don't understand technology.

The more time you spend on something the more you value it. Similarly the more cash you spend on it the more you listen/expect it to provide for you.

With that said, panarino would probably be better off selling a book for profit because people who buy it are actually going to read it and take action.

Post: #39

There is a way to obtain very valuable information for free that no one has mentioned, which is a win-win scenario for both the provider and the information seeker. That is where the provider imparts information by the way of very informative teasers in the hopes of drawing new customers. This is fairly common in the financial industry. You will really need to do your homework to weed through the dirt for the gems.

Here is one example. I include it only because I happened to watch it today. Gary Wagner is one of the early pioneers of candlestick charting in the U.S. (about three decades ago), although traders and speculators had used it in Japan for hundreds of years before its introduction into the U.S. I have read his early groundbreaking books on the topic.

His free content is always most informative and educational. His charting begins about three minutes into the video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=herts9-6J...e=youtu.be

Post: #40

The only true passive income is interest earned from a bank account. However, you would need $4M plus to earn a livable income at today's interest rates (I'm using 1%/year), and most people don't have that.

With other types of passive income, the income goes down as the work does. If Roosh stopped writing blog posts today, he would probably stop making significant income on his books within a couple of years. Almost all income requires work. Even capital gains earned from stocks. You had to research and invest in those stocks, and keep an eye on them and the market.

If you own a rental house, you have to maintain it. If you get a property manager (ie put in less time) your income from it goes down. Instead of looking towards totally passive income, realize that all income will take work to maintain. Just focus on projects and incomes that take very little work to maintain a large income per unit time put in.

Post: #41

(03-02-2014 02:01 AM)Switch Wrote:  The only true passive income is interest earned from a bank account. However, you would need $4M plus to earn a livable income at today's interest rates (I'm using 1%/year), and most people don't have that.

With other types of passive income, the income goes down as the work does. If Roosh stopped writing blog posts today, he would probably stop making significant income on his books within a couple of years. Almost all income requires work. Even capital gains earned from stocks. You had to research and invest in those stocks, and keep an eye on them and the market.

If you own a rental house, you have to maintain it. If you get a property manager (ie put in less time) your income from it goes down. Instead of looking towards totally passive income, realize that all income will take work to maintain. Just focus on projects and incomes that take very little work to maintain a large income per unit time put in.

You'd also have to be incredibly stupid to have all your money in a 1% yielding bank account! Inflation would eat your money away. Dividends can be truly passive. There are companies that have paid dividends consistently for dozens of years even during the crash. That would make more sense to me.

Truthfully even with several million I'd want to continue building wealth so I'd be highly invested in equities with a portfolio approaching 90% equities / 10% other (rental properties). I guess peoples perspectives change as you get older.

Post: #42

(03-02-2014 03:13 AM)lavidaloca Wrote:  

(03-02-2014 02:01 AM)Switch Wrote:  The only true passive income is interest earned from a bank account. However, you would need $4M plus to earn a livable income at today's interest rates (I'm using 1%/year), and most people don't have that.

With other types of passive income, the income goes down as the work does. If Roosh stopped writing blog posts today, he would probably stop making significant income on his books within a couple of years. Almost all income requires work. Even capital gains earned from stocks. You had to research and invest in those stocks, and keep an eye on them and the market.

If you own a rental house, you have to maintain it. If you get a property manager (ie put in less time) your income from it goes down. Instead of looking towards totally passive income, realize that all income will take work to maintain. Just focus on projects and incomes that take very little work to maintain a large income per unit time put in.

You'd also have to be incredibly stupid to have all your money in a 1% yielding bank account! Inflation would eat your money away. Dividends can be truly passive. There are companies that have paid dividends consistently for dozens of years even during the crash. That would make more sense to me.

Truthfully even with several million I'd want to continue building wealth so I'd be highly invested in equities with a portfolio approaching 90% equities / 10% other (rental properties). I guess peoples perspectives change as you get older.

I would never endorse having all of your money yielding only 1% from a bank account, but it is really the only income that requires no work to upkeep. However, dividend-paying stocks also do seem quite low-maintenance, but for the income to be significant, again like the 1% account, you would need a lot of capital to begin with. However, with dividend-paying stocks, there is also the possibility the stock will go up and capital gains can be made.

Post: #43

I guess I don't even understand the appeal of a truly passive income lifestyle. It would be boring for me.

Even billionaires end up getting involved in philanthropy or charity or something to occupy their time, even if it's not necessarily making income anymore.

I think there are many shades in between a cubicle job and sitting on a beach.

Post: #44

(03-04-2014 04:13 PM)Blunt Wrote:  I guess I don't even understand the appeal of a truly passive income lifestyle. It would be boring for me.

Even billionaires end up getting involved in philanthropy or charity or something to occupy their time, even if it's not necessarily making income anymore.

I think there are many shades in between a cubicle job and sitting on a beach.

Think of it as an insurance policy. You never know what life will bring.

I have a brother who became almost fully disabled. If he had built up a passive income rather than partying his life away, he would now have significantly different life options. Most people, however, are too short-sighted to care about the great variety of potential futures.

You can build up a passive income and still stay as active as you wish. They are not mutually exclusive scenarios. Having options is always good.

Post: #45

^That is a good point.

And there's no reason to not hustle and save while you are in your twenties. You have the energy and the longer you are in this game the greater chance you have of accidentally knocking some chick up. I know when I have a family I don't want to be working 60 hours a week.

Post: #46

I have a multi-author sports blog that gets close to 50,000 hits a month. I barely make $100-200/month, which I definitely need to cover hosting costs as the traffic comes in large bursts (i.e hundreds to thousands within an hour), and I need a server that can handle that kind of traffic. So right now, I am barely breaking even.

I have two other sites that get regular 100-200 visitors through search engines, but don't make much from those either.

Blogging can make money, but it takes a lot of time to get to that stage. Also, you need to be in the right niches to make a lot.

Post: #47

^^ Are you a passive income troll?

50,000 visitors a month and you only make $100-200? If you are for real then I suggest working on your monetization strategies. I do better than you with 10% of your traffic.

Post: #48

(03-09-2014 04:38 PM)dreambig Wrote:  ^^ Are you a passive income troll?

50,000 visitors a month and you only make $100-200? If you are for real then I suggest working on your monetization strategies. I do better than you with 10% of your traffic.

I'm curious, how do you monetize? Are you selling your own product, affiliate selling, or advertising? Or a combination of the 3? And in what niche?

Post: #49

(03-09-2014 04:38 PM)dreambig Wrote:  ^^ Are you a passive income troll?

50,000 visitors a month and you only make $100-200? If you are for real then I suggest working on your monetization strategies. I do better than you with 10% of your traffic.

I agree, not trying to knock you just trying to help you because you should be making much more than that. I have about 5-10 blogger blogs which maybe bring in about 10k visitors a month and thats probably on the high side and I make anywhere from $100 - $350 per month. I'm somewhat of an amatuer as well. I'm a good write, have some understanding of SEO but just can't get the hang of wordpress so still using blogger. I never really figured out and implemented capture pages and list building which is from what i hear affiliate money 101 but im still making some decent change. i also recently started implementing amazon in addition to adsense. how are you monetizing because with that type of traffic you shoudl be making alot more, although granted i guess maybe sports isn't the best way to make money necessarily

ive never really had much luck with the pay per action route so have always done more pay per click but just started using amazon and its working pretty well for the little bit ive been doing

Post: #50

(03-09-2014 05:06 PM)Gas Wrote:  

(03-09-2014 04:38 PM)dreambig Wrote:  ^^ Are you a passive income troll?

50,000 visitors a month and you only make $100-200? If you are for real then I suggest working on your monetization strategies. I do better than you with 10% of your traffic.

I'm curious, how do you monetize? Are you selling your own product, affiliate selling, or advertising? Or a combination of the 3? And in what niche?

Two sites in the education niche. I monetize mostly with Amazon but some Adsense too. Amazon is great for people starting out - you WILL make some money because it converts so well. Both sites have been growing in revenue monthly for the last year or two and I barely touch them. I should really write an e-book or something to make some real money but find it hard to find the time between work and game.