Post: #1

I was talking to my roommate's gf tonight and I was disturbed by what she told me.

"you look like a guy that everyone wants to get along with. You are such a pleasant guy."
"You know, when I look at you, I get the feeling that so many girls would want you to be their bf because you seem like such a sweet guy."
"Most girls want a nice guy."

This was all, btw, unprompted. She was drunk and we were all just hanging around when she let a deluge of "cold read" bs on me. And yet, what disturbs me is how common this perception of me is. Not too long ago, my friend's ex-gf told me "you were such a great bf to _____, stop trying to be a player. That's not you." One time, on the subway, I was telling my colleague that I was going to law school. A random man interjected, "you look too nice to be a lawyer. You look like you don't have a drop of evil in you."

Now, this may not be worth griping over. After all, I think my demeanor and my tendency to smile alot makes building rapport with people very easy. However, I get annoyed because it is affecting my results with women. The last girl I dated not only wanted to bf me, but she wanted me to be a subservient, lap-dog beta provider bf to her. Needless to say I only dated her for so long before I dropped her. Another girl I went on a date with cold read me (what is it with women cold reading me these days?) and told me, "you possess machiavellian tendencies, but you are deep down a good person." She also wanted a serious relationship with me.

I guess my main concern is that I am giving off an impression that is too safe and welcoming, which in turn leads to less SNLs/Fwbs/fuck buddies. I don't want to be pidgeon-holed into bf territory. I'm not an asshole deep down inside, but nor am I a saint. I find the "nice guy/good bf" label that women instantly give me to be not only disturbing, but kind of insulting.

What can I do to correct this image? I'm not about to do a 180 on my personality, but a few suggestions on behavioral/presentational/language tweaks to balance out my "good guy" would be greatly appreciated.

Post: #2

Seeing how this seems to be a lot about initial impression you should probably tell us about your look, style and dress sense if you need quality advice.

It's funny, even before that quote about the girl mentioning Machiavelli I was thinking about how that's the impression you'd want to present. "It's far better to be feared than to be loved, if you cannot be both". Not quite so black and white maybe but it is preferable to start with instilling respect rather than likeability. Holding a management role at my job that is one of the most valuable lessons I've learned and people pick up on it fast.

Post: #3

This is something I need advice on as well, probably the biggest challenge facing my game. Girls always tell me I am such a "good guy" and that I am going to "make some girl so happy some day." I think my problem is that I am nice --- I am a nice person in general.

Post: #4

Well, here's my profile:

Asian, 5'6", somewhat of a muscular/bulky frame. I'd say I dress stylish but casual, and nothing too dangerous or badboy-ish. No piercings or tattoos of that sort. I mostly shop at H & M, Aldo, Zara, American Eagle and Banana Republic. I wear glasses. I have a bit of a baby face. Moreover, I am very friendly looking and I smile a lot.

I've been flirting with the idea of dressing edgier, perhaps implementing more black colors and even getting a tattoo. I have contacts, so I will try to wear them more often, even though every brand of contacts under the sky gives my eyes hell.

Post: #5

SHANbangs -

Do you smoke?

Post: #6

(05-28-2011 10:38 AM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  SHANbangs -

Do you smoke?

I smoke weed, cigarettes, and cigars.

Post: #7

Don't do shit, never change.

Prove them wrong...warn em say "I ruin all my girlfriends" then if they still want to kick it with you, proceed to treat em like shit.

Actions speak louder than words....

Post: #8

(05-28-2011 11:52 AM)SHANbangs Wrote:  

(05-28-2011 10:38 AM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  SHANbangs -

Do you smoke?

I smoke weed, cigarettes, and cigars.

Shanbangs-

Interesting that you are getting "too safe" thing.

I think it may be easier to turn this to your advantage.

Use it as a classic "wolf in sheep's clothing" effect.

Post: #9

the key is being the "good/nice guy" that girls WANT to fuck as well as date. Just gotta push the envelope sexually hen the time calls for it.

good example is Brody from The Hills.

Post: #10

I don't see the problem here. I wish I had a friendly face to gain trust easier with girls. I've been told I look like a playa.

Post: #11

(05-28-2011 10:20 AM)SHANbangs Wrote:  Well, here's my profile:

Asian, 5'6", somewhat of a muscular/bulky frame. I'd say I dress stylish but casual, and nothing too dangerous or badboy-ish. No piercings or tattoos of that sort. I mostly shop at H & M, Aldo, Zara, American Eagle and Banana Republic. I wear glasses. I have a bit of a baby face. Moreover, I am very friendly looking and I smile a lot.

I've been flirting with the idea of dressing edgier, perhaps implementing more black colors and even getting a tattoo. I have contacts, so I will try to wear them more often, even though every brand of contacts under the sky gives my eyes hell.

Don't get a tattoo.

I have a baby face as well that mellowed out as I got older. The best thing is you will be set once you hit 30. To counter the "look" I would try to exercise a lot more. Now, if you're one of the "bowling ball" type Asians this means you could get huge - which is hard. If you think you can do high rep lifting/running however and slim down - it works. The baby face really looks GREAT when you're in shape and older. It makes you look much younger than other men.

As for your attitude, you should smile less. Many studies have proven women perceive excessive smiling as beta, and if you grew up in a traditional Asian household - you have to realize most Asian cultures are heavily beta.

You also have to become an asshole. As Nietzsche said, anything you see that is positive in a woman is simply a reflection of yourself. Narcissism rules the day, and male Narcissists are the wost kinds of betas. You probably don't even realize it, but when you love yourself and have no need for any external validation - you will realize the positive qualities of women have nothing to do with things that are important to men, i.e. virtue, power, and even art. You must learn to realize that at best, women are incapable of love as men understand it - they are biologically hardwired to be narcissists. At worst, the are insane and/or evil. Bring them along for the ride and always be aware that you are in control.

Once you get to that point, why smile at them? It's pointless.

Post: #12

I like what Dash said about "pushing the envelope sexually". Thats important for nice guys. It balances out your niceness. Here some other thoughts..

Nice guys only attract prude LTR seeking girls. Fun, sexual, party girls don't like nice guys. They think nice guys are boring pussys. Nice guys have to learn how to be more bold. Nice guys just never do anything bold. I not saying that you have to be an asshole and treat girls like shit, but you can not yield to them every single time and let them have their way. You can not let a woman just have the power in a relationship. It is a turn off for them and they will lose respect for you. A woman expects a man to be somewhat of a leader. The decision maker, the protector. She doesn't want that role. Its not in her nature. She looks to you for that stuff.

Here are some tips for nice guys who need to appear a little stronger and more Alpha...

1. Treat her like she is inferior to you. Don't cater to her. You are a cop. She is a criminal. Treat her something like that.

2. Occasionally cut her off when she is talking. Do it when she starts talking too much and goes into a long story about something stupid. Don't let her just talk and talk. Cut her off and change the subject. Don't worry about what she thinks. She will think that she was being boring/stupid and that you were man enough stop it.

3. Don't ask her for permission.

4. When you're on the phone, ignore her when she is talking. Just as she gets into an important part of a story, start talking to someone else who is in the room with you. You can even start talking to your dog or just pretend there is some else in the room. Don't say "excuse me". Just say "wait, what were you saying?". Then do it again.

5. Show some anger around her. Let her see that you are not always a smiling pussy. When you are on the phone with her, you can yell at your roommate or neighbor. Just make it up. Stage it so he yells back at you and you guys get into a fight. Tell her you need to call her back because you are about to whoop your roommates ass. Then don't call her. She will call hours later with a moist pussy.

6. Don't let her have her way all the time.

7. Cancel on her sometimes

8. Say stuff like this to her sometimes..."Are you serious", "You're an idiot sometimes", "Thats a little lame", "Ok, retard", Have you ever had a boyfriend?", "Did you ride the little yellow bus to school". Etc.

9. Tease her. Make her the butt of your jokes.

10. Talk to her about other girls

11. Don't dress so conservative and proper. Add a little spice and flair to your wardrobe.


Advanced techniques:

1. Get into a fight around her

2. Leave a gun out where she can see it.

3. Slap her around a little. (just kidding). Don't hit women, if she makes you that angry, she has to much power over you.


There is an art to doing this properly. It will take time to learn how do this effectively. This cheat sheet will at least give nice guys some ideas for how to appear more masculine.

Post: #13

(05-28-2011 02:44 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  5. Show some anger around her. Let her see that you are not always a smiling pussy. When you are on the phone with her, you can yell at your roommate or neighbor. Just make it up. Stage it so he yells back at you and you guys get into a fight. Tell her you need to call her back because you are about to whoop your roommates ass. Then don't call her. She will call hours later with a moist pussy.

This is gold (and hilarious). If I ever get the sense a girl is starting to think I'm soft (which doesn't really happen), I'm seriously going to use a variation on this. It's probably hard to pull off, but worth trying just to see if it works--especially if the prospect is slipping away anyway.

It's either going to scare the shit out of her, thinking you're a volatile MFer, or she's going to respect you for being hard on the inside:

Tuthmosis: [screaming like a man] I TOLD YOU TO SHUT THE FUCK UP! [suddenly, with mouth away from the phone]
Girl: What?!
Tuthmosis: Hold on a second. [abruptly set phone down]
Tuthmosis: [in the distance] Seriously, dude, if don't shut your fucking mouth I'm gonna stomp you down. I'm getting tired of your fucking shit.
Shill Roommate/Friend: [Inaudible apology]

[Come back to the phone]

Tuthmosis: Sorry about that, I just had to tell my roommate something.
Girl: Oh my god. What. Was. That?
Tuthmosis: It's fine. You were telling me about...

Post: #14

The beta inside just says "but thats not you, don't try being something you're not"

On the other hand I'm lots of cool things right now that I wasn't before.... so why not fake being a little bad ass until it becomes a part of your personality?

Post: #15

(05-28-2011 05:54 PM)Tuthmosis Wrote:  

(05-28-2011 02:44 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  5. Show some anger around her. Let her see that you are not always a smiling pussy. When you are on the phone with her, you can yell at your roommate or neighbor. Just make it up. Stage it so he yells back at you and you guys get into a fight. Tell her you need to call her back because you are about to whoop your roommates ass. Then don't call her. She will call hours later with a moist pussy.

This is gold (and hilarious). If I ever get the sense a girl is starting to think I'm soft (which doesn't really happen), I'm seriously going to use a variation on this. It's probably hard to pull off, but worth trying just to see if it works--especially if the prospect is slipping away anyway.

It's either going to scare the shit out of her, thinking you're a volatile MFer, or she's going to respect you for being hard on the inside:

Tuthmosis: [screaming like a man] I TOLD YOU TO SHUT THE FUCK UP! [suddenly, with mouth away from the phone]
Girl: What?!
Tuthmosis: Hold on a second. [abruptly set phone down]
Tuthmosis: [in the distance] Seriously, dude, if don't shut your fucking mouth I'm gonna stomp you down. I'm getting tired of your fucking shit.
Shill Roommate/Friend: [Inaudible apology]

[Come back to the phone]

Tuthmosis: Sorry about that, I just had to tell my roommate something.
Girl: Oh my god. What. Was. That?
Tuthmosis: It's fine. You were telling me about...

Tuthmosis, you are one of my favourite posters, your sense of humour is priceless LOLOLOLLOLOLOLOOLOLOL

Post: #16

I think the baby face is fine. You are still young so there are pros and cons to every advantage.

I think you might want to think about watching the film Kids. The guy in there was fcuking a lot of lizards and he was the dweebiest muthafcuka I ever saw.
You can use the baby face as a Trojan Horse to slip into the sweetiest little muffins and turn them out.
But only turn out the potential sluts. Remember, with every power comes responsibility. Don't abuse it.
Learn to identify the slutty lizards and act on it.

Post: #17

(05-28-2011 07:03 PM)Riker Wrote:  The beta inside just says "but thats not you, don't try being something you're not"

On the other hand I'm lots of cool things right now that I wasn't before.... so why not fake being a little bad ass until it becomes a part of your personality?

Exactly, but then again who says it isn't you, though? We've been told to be things against our nature for our entire lives. I was a punk and a fighter as a kid before school got a hold of me, and even then it took years for them to get me to stop fighting.

Post: #18

Are you meeting these girls through social circle or cold approach?

Post: #19

I think you are over-thinking it. I just got back from a quick date with a girl and received a text a minute ago: "Ur so sweet and sexy, thanks again. I owe u xxx ."

Being a good guy is not always a handicap. If you tease them playfully and like someone mentioned above, be sexual and bring their sexuality out, being nice is not a big deal. A gentle ass slap here, hand around neck/shoulders when walking, an ass slap there, talk about getting a lap dance after you beat them in mini golf, teasing with a smile, a few hints of disqualification...You can be a nice, charming guy and still get them interested.

Granted it is more likely to work on shyer, sweeter girls, but it can be done with the right balance on others. Some girls though, like mentioned above, you will definitely need to knock down a peg before continuing being your normal self, and sometimes you will need show them the dick in you, ignore them for a bit if they test you by saying something retarded, etc. But I wouldn't fabricate scenarios about yelling at a roommate, because that's just weird. Be assertive when u need to be.

Be the sweet and sour cocktail. Its delicious.

Post: #20

One of my good friends is a really nice, genuine guy, and he gets laid a lot. He just acts like he doesn't want to get into a relationship and puts out that energy. The best thing to do is just date around and act like YOU want to, without feeling guilty or shameful. I think girls want you to wife them because deep inside, a part of you wants that as well.

Also, I wouldn't play that much around with dress, piercings, because it can look awkward. I would play around more with color schemes and accessories like necklace, rings, watches, etc. But really, it's all about attitude. If you dress like a rockstar but act like a cubicle worker, be prepared to be clowned.

The only way you'll truly change is to use your negative experiences as leverage. Your problems are pretty high quality problems (girls want to be your girlfriend, when you want a stream of fb) but they're not really what you want, so you're not truly happy at this point. Some guys need something as little as this, but some other guys need to be betrayed by someone they really cared for to truly break out of that "nice guy" mold.

So really, at this point, I would say just date multiple people at once, and if girls get pissed, act indifferent and don't promise them anything. Don't get me wrong, girls will get pissed and you will lose some, but whatever.

Post: #21

her's an alpha response the next time a girl cold reads you being such a nice guy, and you are not player material.

Ready?

"Fuck you!"...(and have a smirk on your face as you say it).

You'll be banging within 2 hours.....thank me later.

Mixx

Post: #22

I don't think this is a problem at all. I used to feel as if it was for me, but if you work it properly it's actually a huge advantage. You already have the safety thing down, and that's half the battle, so if they are attracted to you as well you're in. I always go for the make out on date 1 or the latest date 2, I don't think I've ever hooked up with a girl where this didn't happen. So make sure to up things sexually.

Also you can be a good guy, but still be a dick. I've always done this naturally, like hook with her then straight up leave her place. Don't respond to texts for a day and wait for her to text you again. Be insistent on certain things and don't back down. Lead her and get pissed at her every once in a while. The anger thing works better after you are already hooking up or it might be a turn off.

I have the good guy vibe, but I've never been a nice guy. In fact a lot of girls I've dated have told me that 'You're nice, but not a nice guy' and I tend to attract really feminine submissive types.

There's really no reason to be a dick or fake things if it's not you, but it's really about showing the dominant qualities about yourself without going overboard. You don't need to be a bad boy with tattoos, a drug dealer, or fake fights with roommates to accomplish this.

Trust me if you have the good guy vibe, but are also confident and sexual you can be deadly because women trust you more than the bad boy type and that's half the battle.

Only problem you run into is that they tend to fall in love quicker and you can hurt them more, but if you don't go back for repeat sex or make it clear you're not looking for a relationship you can avoid it.

Post: #23

(05-28-2011 02:44 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  I like what Dash said about "pushing the envelope sexually". Thats important for nice guys. It balances out your niceness. Here some other thoughts..

Nice guys only attract prude LTR seeking girls. Fun, sexual, party girls don't like nice guys. They think nice guys are boring pussys. Nice guys have to learn how to be more bold. Nice guys just never do anything bold. I not saying that you have to be an asshole and treat girls like shit, but you can not yield to them every single time and let them have their way. You can not let a woman just have the power in a relationship. It is a turn off for them and they will lose respect for you. A woman expects a man to be somewhat of a leader. The decision maker, the protector. She doesn't want that role. Its not in her nature. She looks to you for that stuff.

Here are some tips for nice guys who need to appear a little stronger and more Alpha...

1. Treat her like she is inferior to you. Don't cater to her. You are a cop. She is a criminal. Treat her something like that.

2. Occasionally cut her off when she is talking. Do it when she starts talking too much and goes into a long story about something stupid. Don't let her just talk and talk. Cut her off and change the subject. Don't worry about what she thinks. She will think that she was being boring/stupid and that you were man enough stop it.

3. Don't ask her for permission.

4. When you're on the phone, ignore her when she is talking. Just as she gets into an important part of a story, start talking to someone else who is in the room with you. You can even start talking to your dog or just pretend there is some else in the room. Don't say "excuse me". Just say "wait, what were you saying?". Then do it again.

5. Show some anger around her. Let her see that you are not always a smiling pussy. When you are on the phone with her, you can yell at your roommate or neighbor. Just make it up. Stage it so he yells back at you and you guys get into a fight. Tell her you need to call her back because you are about to whoop your roommates ass. Then don't call her. She will call hours later with a moist pussy.

6. Don't let her have her way all the time.

7. Cancel on her sometimes

8. Say stuff like this to her sometimes..."Are you serious", "You're an idiot sometimes", "Thats a little lame", "Ok, retard", Have you ever had a boyfriend?", "Did you ride the little yellow bus to school". Etc.

9. Tease her. Make her the butt of your jokes.

10. Talk to her about other girls

11. Don't dress so conservative and proper. Add a little spice and flair to your wardrobe.


Advanced techniques:

1. Get into a fight around her

2. Leave a gun out where she can see it.

3. Slap her around a little. (just kidding). Don't hit women, if she makes you that angry, she has to much power over you.


There is an art to doing this properly. It will take time to learn how do this effectively. This cheat sheet will at least give nice guys some ideas for how to appear more masculine.

Lol at leaving a gun out. Has anyone mastered the "nice guy that's an asshole" routine? This seems like it would be great to gain girls trust because they think you're really a genuine, nice guy. I'm struggling with my look because I have an asshole face which doesn't work with all girls....

Post: #24

the problem is not hearing 'nice things' about you from a girl...the main problem is to BE nice guy which every girl don't like .

when a girl is attracted...she start to admire you..no matter you are bad or nice.

when i act BAD..and when a girl likes me...she says ''i like you because you are nice''

Post: #25

(05-31-2011 01:38 AM)houston Wrote:  

(05-28-2011 02:44 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  I like what Dash said about "pushing the envelope sexually". Thats important for nice guys. It balances out your niceness. Here some other thoughts..

Nice guys only attract prude LTR seeking girls. Fun, sexual, party girls don't like nice guys. They think nice guys are boring pussys. Nice guys have to learn how to be more bold. Nice guys just never do anything bold. I not saying that you have to be an asshole and treat girls like shit, but you can not yield to them every single time and let them have their way. You can not let a woman just have the power in a relationship. It is a turn off for them and they will lose respect for you. A woman expects a man to be somewhat of a leader. The decision maker, the protector. She doesn't want that role. Its not in her nature. She looks to you for that stuff.

Here are some tips for nice guys who need to appear a little stronger and more Alpha...

1. Treat her like she is inferior to you. Don't cater to her. You are a cop. She is a criminal. Treat her something like that.

2. Occasionally cut her off when she is talking. Do it when she starts talking too much and goes into a long story about something stupid. Don't let her just talk and talk. Cut her off and change the subject. Don't worry about what she thinks. She will think that she was being boring/stupid and that you were man enough stop it.

3. Don't ask her for permission.

4. When you're on the phone, ignore her when she is talking. Just as she gets into an important part of a story, start talking to someone else who is in the room with you. You can even start talking to your dog or just pretend there is some else in the room. Don't say "excuse me". Just say "wait, what were you saying?". Then do it again.

5. Show some anger around her. Let her see that you are not always a smiling pussy. When you are on the phone with her, you can yell at your roommate or neighbor. Just make it up. Stage it so he yells back at you and you guys get into a fight. Tell her you need to call her back because you are about to whoop your roommates ass. Then don't call her. She will call hours later with a moist pussy.

6. Don't let her have her way all the time.

7. Cancel on her sometimes

8. Say stuff like this to her sometimes..."Are you serious", "You're an idiot sometimes", "Thats a little lame", "Ok, retard", Have you ever had a boyfriend?", "Did you ride the little yellow bus to school". Etc.

9. Tease her. Make her the butt of your jokes.

10. Talk to her about other girls

11. Don't dress so conservative and proper. Add a little spice and flair to your wardrobe.


Advanced techniques:

1. Get into a fight around her

2. Leave a gun out where she can see it.

3. Slap her around a little. (just kidding). Don't hit women, if she makes you that angry, she has to much power over you.


There is an art to doing this properly. It will take time to learn how do this effectively. This cheat sheet will at least give nice guys some ideas for how to appear more masculine.

Lol at leaving a gun out. Has anyone mastered the "nice guy that's an asshole" routine? This seems like it would be great to gain girls trust because they think you're really a genuine, nice guy. I'm struggling with my look because I have an asshole face which doesn't work with all girls....

I won't say mastered, but with my current girl I came across as "cool". I wasn't pandering to her, but I wasn't exactly being a dick either.