Post: #26

There's an entire thread on the subject of banging Seeking Arrangement women without having to play their games or pay them. Hence, even the self-styled "sugarbabies" (a.k.a., amateur prostitutes without the honesty to admit what they are) will cave in to a guy with the right frame.


I'm curious how she told you what she did - a genuine prostitute standing outside of a hotel, and she just up and propositioned you? That's hardly a top level pay for play approach. Even the ones working the hotel bars in high end hotels are a lot more subtle than that and this one sounds like she was outside the Motel 6 in Evansville, Indiana or something.

Post: #27

This was a suburb of a tier 1 city literally bordering the city.

I was outside having a cigarette.

A guy just walked out the door very quickly to his car, then she came out a few seconds later to also have a cigarette. The doors were right next to each other.

Went into a brief conversation, that was it.

Post: #28

(06-13-2017 10:59 PM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  ^@CR

That's the God's honest truth.

During 99% of the history of our species you had to be a top notch hunter-killer to get pussy.
Only in the very recent past was it the case that the pussy supply was more or less organised, and even then your options were limited to "safe" women who laid on their back and thought of the flag.

I can understand how guys might think it's hard to find a quality wife these days, but getting your dick serviced in any number of different ways by any number of different racial flavours has never been easier.

When it comes to casual fucking the glass is half full, whereas for most if not all of our history the glass has had been not much more than moist.

You could just as easily complain about not having guaranteed in-roads to becoming an astronaut. Common guys with limited means and game NEVER had access to top tier pussy and RARELY had anything but limited access to generic starfish pussy from women who didn't want to be pumping out their 10th kid by the time they were 26 (given that there was close to zero birth control and every birth was a possible death sentence).

If there were a golden age for fucking, this would be it.

Try telling that to the increasing percentage of guys in the west who are effectively completely shut out of their local SMP.

Post: #29

They're still acting like sex-communists in a sex-capitalist world, sitting around on bread lines waiting for the world to become a fair place.

Just as one alpha can service the needs of ten high tier women, one woman can service the needs of ten average tier men.

But the men of today in the west aren't even average. By any standard the women of yesteryear are more masculine than these incels are on their best day. What, they expect women to fuck them when they look like that woman's 15 year old son?

Post: #30

^this. The sexual marketplace is totally deregulated and if all you can do is bitch instead of react, it's hard to sympathize.

Post: #31

(06-14-2017 02:34 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  They're still acting like sex-communists in a sex-capitalist world, sitting around on bread lines waiting for the world to become a fair place.

Just as one alpha can service the needs of ten high tier women, one woman can service the needs of ten average tier men.

But the men of today in the west aren't even average. By any standard the women of yesteryear are more masculine than these incels are on their best day. What, they expect women to fuck them when they look like that woman's 15 year old son?

Or they're the guys sitting there saying "Ewww she's such a slut, I would never bang her"

Fuck losers, and fuck the average man. They can have the scraps.

Post: #32

I'll have sympathy for the average man when he does a little more than average to raise the median.

And at that point he probably won't need my sympathy anyway.

Post: #33

I'm going to stick my neck out and put forward that for more and more woman being an escort is a way to meet men to date ( getting a regular)

Slickboy pointed out the amateur escort edges.."Seeking Arrangement women without having to play their games or pay them"

Independent escort advertisements are showing a trend to being a date site profile. Some ads want guys to answer questions when they text back "a little about themselves" along with requirements for dress, shower prior and fresh breath ....where did this come from? Whatever happened to anonymous sex? Why offer 1/2 hour rates now? from the standard hour? (because if she likes you she wants you to stay longer if not get lost)

I know the appearances are that only men like sex....but women do to... don't overlook this or dismiss it. Are chicks ahead of the curve today are we actually behind the curve?

Let's go at it from another way...if guys could get women to call them and woman paid for it and meet a chick 10...would we do it? (probably have a hard time getting it up for a lot of clients...but yes we would)

I've heard guys (not me) say on numerous occasions the pay to play girl loved the sex...moaned and groaned all wet....why was that?

other examples (I've heard about)

1) Mexican (20) by herself in motel "out call" ....fuk then chat says she's lonely..do you want to go out sometime
2) another (mid 30's)..You can take the condom off if you want....and later ..your cute if you'd like why don't you call me
3) another.(in her house, great neighborhood kids at school)..after a romp in the sack....hey I think I'll keep you, we should do drinks
4) stunning redhead (19).... she says she doesn't have any condoms....after already getting hot n heavy...(oh well)...later a student bored would (not me) want to be a regular and do stuff

From what I hear and read there is a trend going on with these "amateur escorts or independents" Are chicks so frustrated with the "dating scene" or bizzy or lonely or sick of the quality of men around them (no good men left)....that they are aggressively pursuing men/husbands (suckers) under the guise of escorts. I'm fairly certain the old segments of prostitution are still there....but methinks a offshoot is happening

Use to be "average chicks" wouldn't be seen in a Strip Club now they almost out number the guys ( some pseudo lesbians) but (from what I hear)...some of these "average chicks" are trolling for boyfriends at the strip club...if memory serves correctly strippers hate prostitutes working there men and get rid of them from the bar... ERGO if strippers don't care then the "average girls" must be just that

and if that is how hard up a chick has to be to find a single hetero-sexual business guy then things for women are pretty desperate

Post: #34

How I met your mother?

That's a heck of a story to lay on your kids.

Post: #35

LMAO....you think a husband has never yelled that at a wife.....I know lots of guys married to town whores.

I did think some member here would write...Hey that's what tinder is!

Not the same thing....Tinder is a chick that wants to get dressed up and go find out "what show's up" (usually a guy with a knapsack
and broke) and go from there...but it may waste a day which to a desperate chick could be a day to many (I also factor in the Beta's that want to chat for months prior)

I assume a escort is hanging a sign up...saying men line up....and let's see what there is.... that chick has almost complete control of the male herd and doesn't have to drive anywhere.

Let's not forget the New York City..."steak ladies".....girls that prey on men...just for a free dinner..chicks are pretty creative

Post: #36

(06-14-2017 09:11 AM)Premium Wrote:  Hey that's what tinder is!

I know this is going to sound like captain-obvious but for shits and giggles I tried adjusting the age-range on tinder to 22-33 (much younger than age-appropriate for me) and was really shocked at how, um, "semi-pro" the talent was. Note, this is the first time I've ever browsed through Tinder in this age-group. Before this all I really thought about the younger dating scene is via second-hand.

Result: profile after profile of instagram whores with photos that look like they came off the cover of Vogue magazine they were so glossy. Of course, a lot of tats and septum rings on display, but not all.

Although Tinder (or Instagram) may have started out with good intentions, how people use it (or abuse it) is a different matter. This is why Tinder had to start segmenting itself into elite vs. everyone-else, because being hot on Tinder and gathering up matches like Pokemon has become a new form of social-capital for women.

A woman lucky enough to be blessed with good genetics and a healthy lifestyle must be facing enormous temptation these days to become a "semi-pro" like this. I mean, hot chicks always had this temptation, but because of the internet combined with the fat apocalypse, the commodity value of hot women has skyrocketed to all-time highs.

Not all women can break into modeling or acting, but there's no barrier of entry to becoming an instagram whore and it stays firmly on the more respectable side of social stigma vs. stripping or porn. I mean, everyone's narcissistic these days so being seen as self-absorbed is par for the course.

The flip-side of this, of course, is that my post-wall age-group you rarely see women parading around with their Gucci bags and doing duck-face selfies. Instead you see the top ones looking mannish without makeup running marathons and hiking and the occasional token bikini shot to drive the point home that they bust their ass to stay viable.

Post: #37

(06-14-2017 08:40 AM)Premium Wrote:  and if that is how hard up a chick has to be to find a single hetero-sexual business guy then things for women are pretty desperate

Interesting observations. A few things are directing that "desperation" if true: Aging career women, and by "aging" I mean much younger than any girl is ever told (30), fewer and fewer "successful" men moving ahead, and concomitant focus on the classics (decent looking professional and successful (read:older) men alongside young, beautiful women) as what pretty much everyone is eager or starving to find. Basically, the increase in men overall and the increase in those approaching cat lady status is squeezing out all the decent middies, who are super frustrated. And I don't mean these middies aren't quality. They've all just been tricked into probably thinking they deserve more. The ultimate problem is that for a man, he might consider a decent not super old girl IF she could cook, clean and do feminine stuff for him that he doesn't otherwise really like or want to do ... but they rarely bring any of this to the table. At that point, the guys are like, what is this girl adding to my life? Add in sluts giving away the milk for essentially free, marriage being super anti-male, and it's obvious what the outcomes will be.

Post: #38

(06-14-2017 09:51 AM)questor70 Wrote:  

(06-14-2017 09:11 AM)Premium Wrote:  Hey that's what tinder is!

I know this is going to sound like captain-obvious but for shits and giggles I tried adjusting the age-range on tinder to 22-33 (much younger than age-appropriate for me) and was really shocked at how, um, "semi-pro" the talent was. Note, this is the first time I've ever browsed through Tinder in this age-group. Before this all I really thought about the younger dating scene is via second-hand.

Result: profile after profile of instagram whores with photos that look like they came off the cover of Vogue magazine they were so glossy. Of course, a lot of tats and septum rings on display, but not all.

Although Tinder (or Instagram) may have started out with good intentions, how people use it (or abuse it) is a different matter. This is why Tinder had to start segmenting itself into elite vs. everyone-else, because being hot on Tinder and gathering up matches like Pokemon has become a new form of social-capital for women.

A woman lucky enough to be blessed with good genetics and a healthy lifestyle must be facing enormous temptation these days to become a "semi-pro" like this. I mean, hot chicks always had this temptation, but because of the internet combined with the fat apocalypse, the commodity value of hot women has skyrocketed to all-time highs.

Not all women can break into modeling or acting, but there's no barrier of entry to becoming an instagram whore and it stays firmly on the more respectable side of social stigma vs. stripping or porn. I mean, everyone's narcissistic these days so being seen as self-absorbed is par for the course.

The flip-side of this, of course, is that my post-wall age-group you rarely see women parading around with their Gucci bags and doing duck-face selfies. Instead you see the top ones looking mannish without makeup running marathons and hiking and the occasional token bikini shot to drive the point home that they bust their ass to stay viable.

I tried this, and came to the conclusion most of those profiles are bots. I've been in smaller cities (metro population 600,000) with the next significant town 2 hours away, and had hundreds of absolute top notch young beauties on tinder, all with professional quality model pics. What I assumed were real girls have a much different look to their pictures sets.

Actually, the same is true even in the older age groups. I never saw as many wall survivors in their 40's in my life as there are posted on Tinder, again with the model quality photos. I know a lot of girls have high quality photos now for Instagram, but there's no way that this many above average women were available in this area. There were just fake profiles.

Post: #39

(06-14-2017 12:17 PM)RoastBeefCurtains4Me Wrote:  I tried this, and came to the conclusion most of those profiles are bots.

Even when they're hooked up through Instagram? I guess it's hard to verify via reverse image search on mobile.

Post: #40

welcome to the anglosphere...

Post: #41

(06-14-2017 12:21 PM)questor70 Wrote:  

(06-14-2017 12:17 PM)RoastBeefCurtains4Me Wrote:  I tried this, and came to the conclusion most of those profiles are bots.

Even when they're hooked up through Instagram? I guess it's hard to verify via reverse image search on mobile.

Instagram is a good sign of a real woman. Pictures that look like the girl is in a normal apartment are more likely to be real than highly composed images that look like they're from a magazine, especially if every single picture has a super polished, professional, artsy look.

A profile that mentions specific local things is a good sign. I've noticed that a lot of profiles of women I suspected were fake had no specific details. Most bots have empty profiles or one liners, but some try to be more convincing with a better fake profile. They'll have some vague YOLO shit, or stuff about valuing family and friends, but this would be generic stuff that some bot spammer wrote. None of these guidelines are 100% accurate, and I'm sure I suspected wrongly in some cases. However, the number of super pretty girls with unreasonably high quality pictures was way outside of realistic percentages.

If you close your Tinder account, and start a new one, your swipe history is cleared, and you'll be shown accounts as a new user. Watch the ones you swipe, assuming that some are stock photos and bullshit profiles, and look for signs of realness. You'll soon start to recognize fakes, or at least suspect them.

I'm assuming you've had a bot like you back 1/10 second after you liked them. I've had this even though my settings only allow them to see me after I liked them first. You message the bot, and they try to get you to sign up for some scammy website. This is what I'm talking about. There's a recognizable fakeness and lack of individuality to these pictures, and they're usually too hot to be in your town in real life (unless you're in a place like NYC, Miami, etc.).

Post: #42

Horny guy #1 finds a girl on Tinder who is bangable, but right from the get-go has no intention of taking her seriously outside of smashing. He wastes his time "building comfort" via text message to get her number/insta/whatsapp, then wastes more time convincing her to meet up. He wastes 2 hours pretending he gives a shit about what she is talking about, while buying her drinks and maybe even food. Maybe he changes venues and drops more dough while escalating. He convinces her to come over, gives her more food/drink on his dime, and bangs her. Wastes more time making sure she doesn't feel like a slut and pretending he's somewhat interested in seeing her again in order to minimize chances of buyer's remorse. She finally leaves.

Total cost: 5-6 hours of time, $40+ in date costs

Horny guy #2 finds a not amazing but fuckable discount craigslist hooker who will fuck him and do whatever he wants at her hotel for $200. He goes there, fucks twice, gives her a high five, and is out the door 45 minutes later.

Total cost: 1 hour for travel and logistics, $200 in date costs.

Horny guy #3 beats off to Redtube and then goes on with his life.

Total cost: Free

All three guys have successfully drained their balls and have no further commitments to worry about.

Who's the real winner?

Post: #43

@Eddie Winslow you summed up the problem..wasting too much time....cost/value considerations....and weighed down by too many APPS (that are suspect) I don't want to pay for an I.T guy you forgot to add that cost in Eddie!

@questor70 open my eyes at the Tinder situation with glossy profiles in a age range not surprised it's the world [email protected] opened my eyes wider with them dam workarounds and further forensic evaluation for legitimacy...then it's still a judgement call

If (not IF it IS) a service is corrupted or flooded by BOTS...then how do you think the " local amateur or independent" views it?.....she wants game and possibly a boyfriend or $ (or both)

Usually when someone puts (too much) time into things (APPS) he wants the payoff so much so that the main "old days" problem is over looked....will she show up. (if not you cluster fucked yourself....so you make 10 appointments? as a stopgap?)

I wrote above about my friends experiences with ' local amateurs" who liked the cash but were also looking for a boyfriend those experiences didn't happen too long ago.

The site those amateur girls were pulled from is now full of Asians, Latino EE...incredibly..Italy and France....I'm in local 200k population Canada (bum fuk no where )....note these are supposedly local girls up for some cash a new girl appears (after I refresh) every 5 minutes (20 adds with pic's/ video per page... 10 pages to look through.. all ad's time stamped)....a blurb below... (raw message raw English..white blonde photo's..my guess EE)

Hi gentleman

My name is Amanda
I'm super attractive with Sweet personality AMAZING ALL NATURAL BODY TO GO ALONG WITH IT. I LOVE to PLEASE!!
NO RUSHING I offer highest quality of services which leave you unable to LEAVE ME OFF YOUR MIND. Let my captivating BEDROOM EYES, soft sensual touch and SexiNESS drive you wild!! Experience LETS HAVE FUN TONIGHT!!!

This girl (a 9) is sitting around this town in a hotel room...she's local (but just arrived)...similar posts crowd and overwhelm the real amateur locals..in essence the local game is crushed by "semi pro's" flying in and then moving city to city.

I say semi pro's because it takes planning for the group of ladies that fly together to another country and rent motel rooms plus a fuck room (my friend says check for damp towels in the bathroom then you know the last client just left...sloppy 53rd sex is the BEST)...plus English ad's are off sightly with the wording ....and I assume they can't set up an agency (work here)

the... Thread is current situation in America..... and as @Eddie succinctly put it

Horny guy #3 beats off to Redtube and then goes on with his life.

Post: #44

If beating off were as fulfilling as fucking a whore, and if fucking a whore were as fulfilling as acquiring sex on a non-paid basis then there would be no more human race. Stone age man would have beat his meat into old age and the species would have died out.

You could just as easily say that drinking water and eating stale bread from the dumpster behind the local supermarket is free and it'll keep you alive, so why waste money buying steak, much less hunting deer.

Post: #45

(06-14-2017 05:00 PM)Eddie Winslow Wrote:  Horny guy #1 finds a girl on Tinder who is bangable, but right from the get-go has no intention of taking her seriously outside of smashing. He wastes his time "building comfort" via text message to get her number/insta/whatsapp, then wastes more time convincing her to meet up. He wastes 2 hours pretending he gives a shit about what she is talking about, while buying her drinks and maybe even food. Maybe he changes venues and drops more dough while escalating. He convinces her to come over, gives her more food/drink on his dime, and bangs her. Wastes more time making sure she doesn't feel like a slut and pretending he's somewhat interested in seeing her again in order to minimize chances of buyer's remorse. She finally leaves.

Total cost: 5-6 hours of time, $40+ in date costs

Horny guy #2 finds a not amazing but fuckable discount craigslist hooker who will fuck him and do whatever he wants at her hotel for $200. He goes there, fucks twice, gives her a high five, and is out the door 45 minutes later.

Total cost: 1 hour for travel and logistics, $200 in date costs.

Horny guy #3 beats off to Redtube and then goes on with his life.

Total cost: Free

All three guys have successfully drained their balls and have no further commitments to worry about.

Who's the real winner?

Even back when things weren't so bad, there were still guys who would opt for choice 2 or 3 versus getting out and making an effort. All comes down to what you want to put into it, and what you hope to get for your troubles.

MGTOWs tend to fall into this trap way too easily and too early. You may not want to get married right away or at all, but you should at least live in reality while you're able to and not cop out. If your logistical or monetary situation sucks, do something to change it.

Remember too, it isn't just about getting laid. Guy number 1 is doing more for his salesmanship skills, ego and and social capital than either of the other two. Success there will permeate every other aspect of your life. I can't explain it completely, but your frame will radiate way more than the guy who just perfunctorily empties his nut sack from time to time.

If guy number one is still attractive/alpha enough to pull it off, by all means he should keep his skill set sharp and wait for his elderly/broke/IDGAF years to reduce himself to fast food equivalents of sex or sex substitutes like beating off. If while playing the field he finds a keeper in the process, bonus to him. But guys 2 and 3 who think they can see hookers, beat off and then one day find a keeper will instead find themselves too socially retarded to stand a chance at success when it counts. Something to keep in mind.

Post: #46

LMAO Leonard .truth is always the funniest

It's a digital world now full of cave dwellers in cellars and Cialis spam

meThinks I'll just go back to Facebook or other apps tell chicks to hold up a sign with my name on it with a date stamp...Back to the Future!

Post: #47

She won't be able to do that forever. The day she finds that out, it's going to hurt. Real bad.

Post: #48

Guys talk about how ugly American women are these days here. (they have wrinkles after age 25, they are fat, they walk around in flip flops, they don't take care of themselves etc) How about paying attention to men you see daily basis? Will you look at them as dating material if you were a woman?
But these guys have the same desire as tall, ripped, good looking college boys. Where do they go to satisfy their desire? hit up the hipster bar or mall to hit on a cute chick? LOL

Post: #49

(06-14-2017 07:07 PM)SlickyBoy Wrote:  Even back when things weren't so bad, there were still guys who would opt for choice 2 or 3 versus getting out and making an effort. All comes down to what you want to put into it, and what you hope to get for your troubles.

MGTOWs tend to fall into this trap way too easily and too early. You may not want to get married right away or at all, but you should at least live in reality while you're able to and not cop out. If your logistical or monetary situation sucks, do something to change it.

Remember too, it isn't just about getting laid. Guy number 1 is doing more for his salesmanship skills, ego and and social capital than either of the other two. Success there will permeate every other aspect of your life. I can't explain it completely, but your frame will radiate way more than the guy who just perfunctorily empties his nut sack from time to time.

If guy number one is still attractive/alpha enough to pull it off, by all means he should keep his skill set sharp and wait for his elderly/broke/IDGAF years to reduce himself to fast food equivalents of sex or sex substitutes like beating off. If while playing the field he finds a keeper in the process, bonus to him. But guys 2 and 3 who think they can see hookers, beat off and then one day find a keeper will instead find themselves too socially retarded to stand a chance at success when it counts. Something to keep in mind.

What is guy #1 is already a cool guy? It's just business as usual for him then.

Then again, the guys I deal with on a daily basis are naturally cool, probably the opposite of most guys. There's real clowns out there. Most men shouldn't even try to work on themselves, they're far too lame to begin with.

I've known made men who use hookers at least twice a week, and they don't need to.

Post: #50

The amount of effort and skill required in #1 is both a source of frustration AND the main attraction which sets it apart from #2 and #3. That's why it's called "game", right? I'm not a sports guy but when I was a kid I was way into videogames, the twitch kind like Robotron that really drove your adrenaline. Those games were incredibly frustrating and merciless. But the feeling of actually getting better at it and watching your score go up and reaching higher levels is really good. No-pain-no-gain pretty much applies to all aspects of self-improvement.

Of course, if you roll the score on Robotron, it won't love you back, hence you won't find love from the modern cock-carousel-rider. So I think what @Eddie Winslow is saying is that he's not just chasing women for disposable SNLs and would like real intimacy leading to a LTR. On that front, the social-contract as it were between men and women may be broken.